Incident During OW Training- What do you do?

[battles2a5]

Was the "Instructor at the dive shop" who said you were "ready" for AOW, the same person who didn't teach you about safety checks or a different instructor?

No, I changed shops as soon as I finished my cert. This was a new shop, new instructor. He was giving a rescue diver course to another diver on 2 of my other dive trips so I was asking a lot of questions on the ride out and during surface intervals when he wasn't teaching. I mentioned to him that I was interested in continuing my training and after a couple of dives he said I was good to go for AOW. This course WAS through PADI, btw.

 

[Otter]

I was in the Madison AL quarry.

Never been there. Did you do the same skill in a pool first or do they use the quarry as a 'confined water" environment. Perhaps SSI and (it appears) NAUI require BCD R&R in both open water and confined water.

 

[TheRedHead]

Never been there. Did you do the same skill in a pool first or do they use the quarry as a 'confined water" environment. Perhaps SSI and (it appears) NAUI require BCD R&R in both open water and confined water.

We did both. I was SSI locally and did my OW checkout dives with a NAUI instructor. If you don't remove the right arm from the BC, it's quite easy.

I think NAUI is tougher. We also did the CESA with my air turned off and my BC inflator disconnected from about 45 feet.

 

[AXL72]

I have seen rental octos with mold on the inside of the mouthpiece. Now imagine yourself buddying up with a diver renting a reg with octo....mmmm....yummmy!


Makes ya wanna go out and buy a pony bottle and stock in a pony bottle manufacturer, ey?

so.....is it ok to ask the following "grosser than gross" questions?

How many dive operators replace reg mouthpieces with steril new mouthpieces after each rental period / renter use?

IF mouthpieces are not replaced with steril ones between renters, what solvents and concentration ofsolvents are used to sterilize the mouthpieces between renters?

or...is it believed that saltwater and the freshwater rinse kills bacteria, mold, and viruses?

John Pennekamp State Park includes the cost of new, unopened plastic wrapped snorkels in the cost of snorkel trips. Why don't dive operators do the same thing with inexpensive mouthpieces on rental regs?

Since patrons of dive shops sign the liability release forms, does that mean they cannot sue no matter how criminally negligent the dive operator is in causing them harm? If a buddy catches some sort of bodily fluid born disease from using a rental octo in an out of air situation, does that mean he is SOL and cannot sue for pooor hygiene practices of the shop?

With the liability waiver signed, is the diver prevented from reporting such circumstances to PADI or other certifying agency in order to avoid being sued for breach of the liability release?

What sanitizing standards and specifications does PADI and other certifying agencies endorse or enforce for sterilizing rental reg mouthpieces?

Could diving with rental gear be more dangerous than going to a tatoo parlor where the artist replaces his rubber gloves between patrons and sterilizes / uses sterilized equipment?

Is this a non issue simply because we cannot see the organisms that remain on rental regs? or is this a non-issue because no organisms survive between rentals?

and last but not least, how does the dive shops effectively get chunks out of a rental reg that was exposed to underwater vomiting?

Yummy, I know.,,,worth discussing / addressing? or out of sight out of mind?

:freak:

 

[PerroneFord]

Thanks for reminding me why I own 3 sets of regs, and my own wetsuit. And why I keep spare, NEW, mouthpieces in my bag...

 

[Puffer Fish]

Ok, where are the NAUI instructors???

I suppose that nothing would be a shock to me today in OW training, but something is really, really wrong here.

A couple of questions:

1. Why does Battles feel responsible for the equipment he was using in open water training? At that point, the student is learning, not "responsible". If he had not learned a predive inspection, no had how the equipment works and was not expected to inspect anything, then why feel responsible? If all that was done, and the student, who is new at it, did not do it correctly, then feeling responsible makes sense.

2. If the instructor had to provide air to a student (it happens, even when everything is working correctly), what happened to the post dive review?

3. Open water students, telling a instructor/dive shop what needs to be fixed? If the students have to do that, then there is more wrong than a botched uw exersize.

If the instructor is watching someone do an exersize, and the student is suddenly struggling, you would think the response would be for the instructor to address the issue first, not the student.

I know there are shops that do not repair and maintain equipment because they are either cheap or lazy or both, but if that were the case, I have never seen these same places suddenly do whatever is asked of them, at whatever cost.

I'm glad that no one was hurt, but if this was actually what happened, then NAUI needs to know.

Puffer - NAUI instructor #4186 (retired from teaching)

 

[oly5050user]

We did both. I was SSI locally and did my OW checkout dives with a NAUI instructor. If you don't remove the right arm from the BC, it's quite easy.

I think NAUI is tougher. We also did the CESA with my air turned off and my BC inflator disconnected from about 45 feet.

not to say your training was dangerous but turning air off at 45' for a cesa and bc inf disconnected did not leave a very good safety margin if something was wrong..I am saying this from the view point of a retired ssi instructor and a current idcs padi instr..I do not know naui standards but this does not sound right to me..seems the naui instr was being too "creative" in his/her training..

 

[scubadobadoo]

not to say your training was dangerous but turning air off at 45' for a cesa and bc inf disconnected did not leave a very good safety margin if something was wrong..I am saying this from the view point of a retired ssi instructor and a current idcs padi instr..I do not know naui standards but this does not sound right to me..seems the naui instr was being too "creative" in his/her training..

Agreed, especially when something as simple as clearing a mask and breathing at the same time could be considered task loading for some new students. When I first started diving I was a mess, and I'll admit it. Not that being a mess means an instructor should go easy on a student mind you.

 

[ClayJar]

How many dive operators replace reg mouthpieces with steril new mouthpieces after each rental period / renter use?

My LDS has a large sign saying that due to health and safety concerns, you must provide your own mouthpiece for their rental (or class) regulators. However, they don't require you to provide your own mouthpiece for the octo...

Well, at least my dive buddy would have had a nice, clean mouthpiece should she have had a catastrophic equipment failure last weekend. (I own my gear, but she rents for now.) Now, if only my LDS had a 19 cu.ft. pony in the shop so I could try it on for size...

 

[cerich]

Ok, where are the NAUI instructors???

I suppose that nothing would be a shock to me today in OW training, but something is really, really wrong here.

A couple of questions:

1. Why does Battles feel responsible for the equipment he was using in open water training? At that point, the student is learning, not "responsible". If he had not learned a predive inspection, no had how the equipment works and was not expected to inspect anything, then why feel responsible? If all that was done, and the student, who is new at it, did not do it correctly, then feeling responsible makes sense.

2. If the instructor had to provide air to a student (it happens, even when everything is working correctly), what happened to the post dive review?

3. Open water students, telling a instructor/dive shop what needs to be fixed? If the students have to do that, then there is more wrong than a botched uw exersize.

If the instructor is watching someone do an exersize, and the student is suddenly struggling, you would think the response would be for the instructor to address the issue first, not the student.

I know there are shops that do not repair and maintain equipment because they are either cheap or lazy or both, but if that were the case, I have never seen these same places suddenly do whatever is asked of them, at whatever cost.

I'm glad that no one was hurt, but if this was actually what happened, then NAUI needs to know.

Puffer - NAUI instructor #4186 (retired from teaching)

I agree and if someone wants to write a complaint who is a witness I will ensure that it is investigated.

Chris Richardson
NAUI 17055
NAUI Rep Cayman