In Response to "a Unified Dive Industry"

[DiveNav]

....... the computer/internet, CTV, and video gaming industry is doing a great job in competing for both the discretionary dollar and discretionary time. Want to shoot, here is a new computer program - hundred bucks is a lot cheaper than $500 for a gun and I don't need to hire an instructor or leave the house. Wanna fly, here a flight simulator program and I don't have to put gas in the car. Wanna scale a wall, here a rock climber game and I don't have to worry you'll get hurt......

Want to dive? Here a free scuba diving simulator ....

OMG ... Am I in trouble now?

Alberto

 

[rstofer]

Nope, the dive shop must remain for the industry to be viable. Just because PADI embraces eLearning, doesn't mean that all sheep will follow. I don't think the majority are willing to learn to use life support equipment over the internet, then end up with whomever as their final openwater checkout diver. If that is true, then I will haul down the shingle right now.

How is that different than walking into an LDS and signing up for the next OW course. The new student knows ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about the sport and even less about the instructor.

They threw caution to the wind the moment they decided to get involved with this sport.

Over in New Divers there's a thread that questions whether a person could learn to dive by watching movies. The consensus in NO! But it's probably wrong, in a way.

Anybody who can read "The New Science Of Skin Diving" and do the exercises is quite capable of becoming a diver without an instructor. Similarly with the BSAC manual. All the material is laid out, all the requirements are specified. Sure, it will be a little more risky (maybe) but with time and effort, a person could become at least as good as what an instructor kicks out with a couple of pool sessions and 4 OW dives. The DIY program would take longer but given a strong interest, it should be quite possible. Air fills aside...

As to whether other agencies follow PADI's lead? Of course they will. They already chased them down the minimal training rathole. Why not eLearning? PADI leads the way, right or wrong!

Maybe it all works out and things go back to the way people think they remember them. But things change. For millions of years the dinosaurs ruled the earth. Now we put them in our gas tanks.

Once Internet sales became a reality, the dinosaurs were doomed. Now, if they would just die quietly.

Richard

 

[DaleC]

I can't help but think that one problem "the industry" has is the notion that it has to "continue to grow" in its current form.

Call me a cynic but the only way I see this occuring is by enticing more and more people to diving who probably shouldn't be diving. They are sucked into "trying it" like tandem skydiving but unlike tandem skydiving they are forced to buy hundreds of dollars worth of "personal kit" that in a year or so they will never use again. Another way they are enticed is by continously lowering standards or "repackaging" training so that entry level SCUBA becomes easier for low motivated people to swallow. Is diving being grown by including sub standard participants? Is anyone surprised when they drop SCUBA for the next fad and sales drop?

Most diving gear is "over manufactured" and should last many years which puts a crimp in ongoing sales so many manufacturers/retailers continually create false needs, false fears or reinvent the wheel to sell gear divers don't really need. After divers have gained experience (sometimes) they can see past the BS handed to them so the relationship with many LDS's changes for the worse. The poor LDS then relies more on the unsuspecting new diver to make the bulk of their sales and so the cycle goes.

Perhaps a crazy direction to go would be to create more honesty and integrity at the LDS level in order to to deepen and diversify the market instead of trying to expand the already over exploited new/non diver pool. I never saw a BP/W (or any tech gear) at my local LDS and was told it was "not for me". Too bad, because when I switched over to that system I had already found other (non LDS) outlets for my diving dollars.

Having said that, not all LDS's, manufacturers etc... are poor. Some are very good. If what I said doesn't apply to you - don't take offense. We also suffer the same issues in the saltwater aquarium industry where more and more people are encouraged to purchase systems that they really should not own and sold products they really do not need. All in the name of growing the industry. And like diving, I am constantly being asked by these same people if I know someone who wants to buy a used system a year or three down the road.

 

[Wookie]

Majority we are not.....I do agree with that. However watch out how you center them out and belittle them because they are still your customers and still carry a ton of clout with other divers. These people that you reference are the ones that you have easy access too. Some of us actually know a thing or two as well. Don't steer away from the people on these boards.....use them.

Far from belittling, I embrace the member of these boards, after all, you don't see one or two posts after my name. If every diver were a board member, my advertising would be covered, and I wouldn't have to search out other means to get to the diver. My point is that not everyone is a member, nor does everyone have access, nor do most people care about them. My wife thinks I'm silly for spending so much time here. Board members are but a pulse of the industry, not the majority. Sorry if you felt slighted by my post.

Frank

 

[cerich]

How is that different than walking into an LDS and signing up for the next OW course. The new student knows ABSOLUTELY NOTHING about the sport and even less about the instructor.

They threw caution to the wind the moment they decided to get involved with this sport.

Over in New Divers there's a thread that questions whether a person could learn to dive by watching movies. The consensus in NO! But it's probably wrong, in a way.

Anybody who can read "The New Science Of Skin Diving" and do the exercises is quite capable of becoming a diver without an instructor. Similarly with the BSAC manual. All the material is laid out, all the requirements are specified. Sure, it will be a little more risky (maybe) but with time and effort, a person could become at least as good as what an instructor kicks out with a couple of pool sessions and 4 OW dives. The DIY program would take longer but given a strong interest, it should be quite possible. Air fills aside...

As to whether other agencies follow PADI's lead? Of course they will. They already chased them down the minimal training rathole. Why not eLearning? PADI leads the way, right or wrong!

Maybe it all works out and things go back to the way people think they remember them. But things change. For millions of years the dinosaurs ruled the earth. Now we put them in our gas tanks.

Once Internet sales became a reality, the dinosaurs were doomed. Now, if they would just die quietly.

Richard

many moons ago you could purchase a US Divers regulator in the SEAR catalogue, with the reg came a comic book like instruction manual on how to dive.

before my time but I have seen both th eold SEARS catalogues and the comic book.

 

[ScubaSteve]

Far from belittling, I embrace the member of these boards, after all, you don't see one or two posts after my name. If every diver were a board member, my advertising would be covered, and I wouldn't have to search out other means to get to the diver. My point is that not everyone is a member, nor does everyone have access, nor do most people care about them. My wife thinks I'm silly for spending so much time here. Board members are but a pulse of the industry, not the majority. Sorry if you felt slighted by my post.

Frank

It takes a lot more than that to make me feel slighted....not to worry .

 

[rstofer]

The only thing a dive shop has going for it is for people who do not know how to service their own gear. That's the one solid argument that I support.

There are some highly regarded service centers that use the Internet and UPS. In fact, if I buy from LP, I probably have to send my regs back there anyway. I actually buy my regs on eBay so there is no returning them for service.

And what makes me believe that the service tech has any idea about how to really do the service? I haven't always had the best results using LDSs. But it turns out that if I'm willing to send my regs clear across the country, I can get excellent results. Ah, the Internet and UPS.

So, again, what's the LDS mean to me? Air fills. I just haven't gotten around to buying a compressor. But it's on the list...

Richard

 

[mike_s]

..... Then there are the folks who spend a lot of time on these chat boards. Let us not be swayed by them, as they do NOT make up the majority of divers.......

Board members are but a pulse of the industry

Good backpedaling there....

 

[ScubaSteve]

I just haven't gotten around to buying a compressor. But it's on the list...

There may be some coming on the market soon . Just kidding. I do not wish anyone bankruptcy unless they sit back and do nothing to adjust for the times. Flexibility will take a business a long way (not all the way but a long way). I will support an LDS that is genuinely trying to keep up with the times but tend to steer clear of any shop that "curses the evil giants" as the OP did. I go places to buy things...not to see drama unfold.

 

[Wookie]

Good backpedaling there....

Gimme a break Mike. I should have said Board members are but a pulse of the industry, the heartbeat doesn't visit here. That doesn't mean I count board members (of whatever board) out, it just means that what I read on the internet I take with a grain of salt.