Iberostar Cozumel dock fees!!!!!

[billindenver]

Perhaps I phrased it wrong, but 'would likely be cheaper' is referring to the other two ops. DWM remains my favorite aluminum op and as I've said a dozen times in this thread alone they are every bit as good as at least one of the two in here bashing them. If they changed their minds on picking up at Iberostar, I would dive with Dressel without complaint.

I suppose one of the dangers of a thread that runs 23 plus pages is that it easy for people to forget (perhaps conveniently) the facts stated earlier. It is NOT $5.00 per diver but a monthly fee that will range from $50.00 to $500.00 per month. If there are a very limited number of guests picked up per month (as has been stated by Bill) then my “simple math” calculates out at a lot more than $5.00 per diver. I have no doubt that Christie and Antonio both have bookkeepers that know how to use a spreadsheet but, unless they also have skills at creative accounting, I doubt that they can convert $50.00 per month divided by two or three divers into $5.00 a head.

Yes, and your guilty of that forgetfulness. Neither of the ops you named have picked up anywhere near enough divers to exceed the $50 a month charge....by their own assurances in this thread. The $500 a month they keep attempting to reference would be for a dive op who picked up far more divers than either of their ops ever will at Iberostar. If they are picking up so few that the $50 a month comes out to more than $5 a trip (two divers, 5 days) then charge the client more...or don't pick up there. Every dive op will have to decide whether they get enough business from Iberostar to bother with it. These two apparently do not. Dive with Martin apparently does.

As far as the attacks that you assure us don't exist. Perhaps you should read the thread for a third time. Read post number 1 and 173 for the cliff notes version. Assertions that they are stealing the marine park fees (likely a federal offense if anything like the states), 'reasons why they are so cheap', assertions of high pressure sales tactics, under trained dive masters...if you believe they are complimenting DWM and Dressel on their astute business practices and not trying to get those in here to look at them in a negative light...then we disagree.

 

[judydivescoz]

Perhaps I phrased it wrong, but 'would likely be cheaper' is referring to the other two ops. DWM remains my favorite aluminum op and as I've said a dozen times in this thread alone they are every bit as good as at least one of the two in here bashing them. If they changed their minds on picking up at Iberostar, I would dive with Dressel without complaint.



Yes, and your guilty of that forgetfulness. Neither of the ops you named have picked up anywhere near enough divers to exceed the $50 a month charge....by their own assurances in this thread. The $500 a month they keep attempting to reference would be for a dive op who picked up far more divers than either of their ops ever will at Iberostar. If they are picking up so few that the $50 a month comes out to more than $5 a trip (two divers, 5 days) then charge the client more...or don't pick up there. Every dive op will have to decide whether they get enough business from Iberostar to bother with it. These two apparently do not. Dive with Martin apparently does.

As far as the attacks that you assure us don't exist. Perhaps you should read the thread for a third time. Read post number 1 and 173 for the cliff notes version. Assertions that they are stealing the marine park fees (likely a federal offense if anything like the states), 'reasons why they are so cheap', assertions of high pressure sales tactics, under trained dive masters...if you believe they are complimenting DWM and Dressel on their astute business practices and not trying to get those in here to look at them in a negative light...then we disagree.

You are starting to sound crazier and crazier with your axe to grind attitude.
Its not normal behavior.

 

[caseybird]

:kiss2: :mooner: :kiss2: :mooner: :kiss2: :mooner: :kiss2: :mooner: :kiss2: :mooner: :kiss2: :mooner: :kiss2: :mooner:

Totally smooth. Disrespecting the public always works as a business tactic. What op are you?

 

[CozumelAntonio]

Totally smooth. Disrespecting the public always works as a business tactic. What op are you?

I am not an Op. I am a individual person, and post as such (been doing it for many years). Though I work for a dive center, I don't sign my posts on behalf or in representation of my employer.

Have you read this entire thread? (I doubt it since it is clear who my employer is) Or is your comment based on the last few posts? Maybe you're a friend of Bill?? I will somewhat agree with you though, I have no respect for what he writes, and if you knew anything, you would know that I was mocking the absolute BS he posted.

 

[rossandmaureen]

I am often guilty of forgetfulness (when is my anniversary again?) but not in this case. It didn’t seem necessary to mention that neither Scuba Du or Blue XT Sea have minimal pick-ups at the IB as they both stated so…as did Bill. Maybe I should have mentioned it as it is seems to be one of the few things they agree upon! As for the price range being between $50.00 and $500.00, that is the reality as evidenced by the email from the IB security guy. Leaving out the $500.00 for now and only focussing on the $50.00 per month, it still remains uneconomic for smaller ops to pick-up guests at the IB and, while this minor loss of business will not significantly impact on the dive op, it will be a major inconvenience and/or expense for those few IB guests who have their favourite dive operator but have otherwise perfectly valid reasons to stay at this, a very nice all-inclusive. A taxi to the Caleta is what, $14.00 each way? So…tip in, around $30.00 per day for five or six days of diving plus a few evening trips into town for dinner at some favourite restaurants…not chump change in my book and enough to make me reconsider where I would stay. Of course Christie, being the self-serving business poster on the board is likely receiving some restaurant commissions for listing these businesses in the sticky!

With my failing memory in mind I did re-read the thread to search out the slander, insinuations and attacks and can’t for the life of me find any. What Antonio said in post #1 is factual about how Dressel runs their intern program. There is no slander there…it is what it is. Now I do think that it was unnecessary and inappropriate that he added this part (the posting about the pier fees would have been sufficient) because he works for a competitive firm but he does post here as a member of the dive community and not as a representative of his employer.

In terms of what they were cited as saying in post #173:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Christi http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/322652-iberostar-cozumel-dock-fees-post5069116.html#post5069116
There are also a multitude of other reasons they are a very low priced dive operation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CozumelAntonio http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/322652-iberostar-cozumel-dock-fees-post5069848.html#post5069848
As it was mentioned, there are many reasons why DWM is so cheap, the "wristbands for dock fees promotion" is only the tip of that iceberg... I have nothing against DWM and I wish them the best, so I will leave it at that...

Others had brought DWM into this thread and noted that they were about 25% cheaper so Christie and Antonio simply acknowledged that, yes, they are and there are reasons for that without saying anything negative about DWM. For all we know it could be that DWM is smarter, has a better business model or is willing to work on tighter margins. If I say that there are a multitude of reasons why Costco or Sam’s Club is cheaper than Macy’s there are no negative connotations…just stating that there are reasons for the differences. It is interesting to note, however, that there seem to be more new dive operators adopting the business model and pricing of Blue XT Sea, Aldora and Living Underwater than DWM.

It is also important to be consistent in what we post as I see some stories bounce around more than a panga in a Norte. We read of a willingness to dive with Dressel in one post while in many other posts on this board there is a stated current preference for Aldora because of an affinity for steel tanks and longer dives.

“I would dive with them again......if Aldora's fleet was completely destroyed in a Hurricane and Memo couldn't find a row boat for me to row us out to the reef in.”

I must have missed the news about the hurricane and obviously Memo is still looking for the row-boat.

I am in agreement that the thread should be kept alive and note that it wasn’t Christie that originally called for it being closed (yes she agreed with that poster) but if any of us are going to make statements they need to be factual and not speculation. Where, for example is your direct knowledge that Antonio’s internet campaign helped spark the altercation on the dock?

“It wasn't Antonio's dive op that suffered, but it was his internet campaign against the resort that helped spark it.”

My speculation is that if senior management was actually following this thread they would be intelligent enough to initiate discussions with the outside dive-ops rather than place their guests in an awkward situation. Not everyone in this world is looking for a physical solution with a whooping to solve a problem.

 

[cvchief]

I see some stories bounce around more than a panga in a Norte.

That is my favorite part. And yes, yes I did have to google "panga"...... :gondolalove:

 

[caseybird]

I am not an Op. I am a individual person, and post as such (been doing it for many years). Though I work for a dive center, I don't sign my posts on behalf or in representation of my employer.

Have you read this entire thread? (I doubt it since it is clear who my employer is) Or is your comment based on the last few posts? Maybe you're a friend of Bill?? I will somewhat agree with you though, I have no respect for what he writes, and if you knew anything, you would know that I was mocking the absolute BS he posted.

My dear friend Antonio,
Perhaps my question about which dive op are you was poorly framed. Let me restate:
What op are you employed by? I've read much of the thread, however I really didn't want to wade through all 25+ pages again. Your nonsense about posting as an individual means nothing in this conversation, you are clearly representing a dive operator's point of view.

Let me remind you of what my post was about, you used 2 smilies together to indicate "kiss my" "ass". Do you think this is appropriate business behavior? Does your employer? I don't. My employer doesn't. In fact, if I put that in an e-mail I would be fired. As a diver and customer, I wouldn't use that op. My choice, my dollars.

You don't respect Bill? Tough. You're in a public forum. Keep it professional.

As far as the topic of dock fees, I can't discern any right for a dive op to use a hotel's facilities free of charge. Thev reasons presented seem to be: (quotes paraphased)
"Custom: we've always done it that way here." Tough luck with this one. The business world changes, you adapt or die. Ask the local dive shop.
"The guest has already paid for the pier". Sure, but he's not paying for the dock in this situation. The op is paying for his use of the pier. Frankly, from what I've seen in Coz, every transaction requires a payment. Call it a fee, or a tip, or hide it in the bill; money always changes hands.
"It's hard to run a business in Cozumel". Sure is. It's hard to run a business anywhere. Ask the LDS guy again. Or Lehman Brothers.
"It's too much, we never pick up anyone there anyway". If it's too much, don't pick up there, or negotiate the price with the resort. If you're only picking up a few people a month, charge the diver a surcharge for pick up. Let the diver know ahead of time.
"It's OK is Scuba Club does it, not so OK if the Iberostar does". This one just mystifies me.

More thoughts on Coz and divers: When I first visited Coz in 1999, it seemed divers were everywhere, they were most of the guests in the Hotel Coz. In the last few years, I have the distinct impression that divers are diminishing in numbers. There are a lot more vacationers in the resorts, a lot less divers. I suspect that divers are no longer a big part of the mix at the Iberostar. I'm betting that most divers there are with non-diving family members, they want a good resort and are willing to pay for it. If they want to use a small op, let them know they will have to pay the surcharge, or get to the caleta themselves. Very few divers are interested in getting into your war.
Perhaps there are statistics that prove that I'm wrong about the relative proportions of divers to non-divers. I would be interested in seeing them.
I don't think divers will ever be that important again to the big resorts. Trying to change the dock policy by getting a few SB divers to boycott resorts that charge a fee is laughable. Put your efforts into being a great dive op that people will be happy to pay extra for.
Dive safe.

 

[pidgiepoo]

Perhaps I phrased it wrong, but 'would likely be cheaper' is referring to the other two ops.

Perhaps you did..but I forgive you.

 

[rossandmaureen]

Nothing to do with this thread but....Canada wins Olympic Hockey Gold in a nail biter with a great U.S. squad!

Okay...now we can go back to regular postings.

 

[cvchief]

Caseybird,

Not to get into your with Antonio, but I still contend Antonio or whoever ISNT using the hotel's facilities for FREE. I, as a guest, paid to stand on that dock. I walked out there several times. The ocean entry is there as the water's edge is so bad. If I want to step off that dock onto a boat, I should be able to or they should clearly post the dock isnt included in the facilites I can use as a guest. Shouldnt be any different from stepping from the IB gatehouse into a taxi on the street out front.

The other two pay docks are owned by the diveshop, so they are free to their customers. Any other diver pays for it.
SCC is just private. All three seem different from IB making a dive op collect money from ME for me using the IB dock at the resort I am paying. now stay down.....