How Shops Typically Manage Small Group Boat Dives

[nolatom]

Another subset of DM in-water, are drift dives. The DM is attached to a surface buoy that tells the captain where (most of) the divers are, since most of us cluster around the DM, though many do not. Either way is fine. You surface in a free ascent, and inflate your safety sausage so the boat can see you. Usually the boat is close by.

This is the West Palm/ Jupiter dive scene with which I'm familiar. The Gulf Stream is usually the main ingredient, drifting us all to the North.

My other dives are New England, where you're "on your own", and the Flower Gardens Marine Sanctuary liveaboards, ditto. And Florida panhandle, where it could go either way, depending on the operator.

General philosophy: don't count on having a guide or a babysitter, you're a certified diver, act like one. Then if you get a DM as a guide, wonderful, use it or don't..

 

[caydiver]

So perhaps this will help. Most ops in Grand Cayman typically offer 2T dives. The first dive is generally between 80 and 110 ft. Most recreational divers are not certified to that depth unless they are with a DM or instructor. The underwater topography here is such that our walls are minutes away by boat. Many dive sites especially those with swim throughs would be inaccessible without a DM in the water. They are not there to babysit, provide you with an escort for low air, sun tanning, depletion of your wallet etc. They are there so guests can get the most out of the type of diving that Cayman waters can afford. If you are planning to dive within recreational limits you can easily rent gear do a short swim from shore and drop down with just your buddy. It is certainly a viable option which many enjoy but you would be missing some wonderful opportunities. Basically the boat dives are normally a deep (too deep for most unaccompanied) and a shallow that you can do with your buddy.

 

[Suppresst]

So perhaps this will help. Most ops in Grand Cayman typically offer 2T dives. The first dive is generally between 80 and 110 ft. Most recreational divers are not certified to that depth unless they are with a DM or instructor. The underwater topography here is such that our walls are minutes away by boat. Many dive sites especially those with swim throughs would be inaccessible without a DM in the water. They are not there to babysit, provide you with an escort for low air, sun tanning, depletion of your wallet etc. They are there so guests can get the most out of the type of diving that Cayman waters can afford. If you are planning to dive within recreational limits you can easily rent gear do a short swim from shore and drop down with just your buddy. It is certainly a viable option which many enjoy but you would be missing some wonderful opportunities. Basically the boat dives are normally a deep (too deep for most unaccompanied) and a shallow that you can do with your buddy.

Ya, you've all been incredibly helpful and patient and I really do appreciate it. One thing you need to appreciate is the variables involved for me (and my wife) on this trip - I want to dive deep over a wall, but haven't dived for 30 years, so I got to get back up to speed, and my wife wans to take OW, down there in Caymans, on this trip, for first time. Add in the peculiarities of Cayman diving spelled out by caydiver above, and my varying experiences on boats and with divemasters, etc., and it's all a little mind boggling. By I'm finally beginning to get a leg over it.

I guess most of your are serious hobbyists and a lot of this is "been there, done that" for you, but I'm just trying to set the table for a good initial trip for me and my wife. Yes I'm aware of the risks of over-thinking and over-planning, but the other factor is it's snowy and cold where I live right now and it's just plain fun to engage with, and chat about, scuba again. I enjoy these forums. Thanks again.

 

[Suppresst]

This is kind of a hot topic on the Board, particularly in the pro forums. The situation seems to be:
--too many instructors, so the pay sucks.
--too many divemasters, thus many of the boat jobs are without pay. Tips, yes--Free air, yes, and a chance to get out and dive without paying the $100 or so.
--too many DMs doing this and assisting on courses without pay because they love diving and want to share it with students and want to "give something back" (that's nice if you're LeBron James worth half a billion).
--some DMs (and instructors) do other jobs at a shop, like retail. I would not have assisted with courses if the owner didn't pay me at least minimum wage. But that's just me.
As to where the fees for charters go if not to the crew, I imagine to gas, the Captain and the shop/op owner. But I am not well-versed on this. Either way, running a dive shop/op apparently is difficult financially for many.
--Though I've never DMd a charter, I know they do a lot of other stuff such as preparing the boat, safety equipment, maybe some paperwork, cleaning the boat after the trip, washing stuff, securing the anchor at the dive site, giving a dive site briefing, making sure every diver is accounted for, etc. Some of this work is not seen by the customer. All this is another reason why I would never do this for just tips and a free boat ride & dive or two.
--to my knowledge most instructors and DMs in Canada and U.S. have full time normal day jobs.

Now this is interesting - and I'd like to know more about it. I mean the way I'm looking at it, as customer (at least for this trip to the Caymans) is I'm paying what I consider to be a "full" price to go out on a two-tank boat trip. Now, I'm talking about value for money. How much would I pay for a toaster? How much for tickets to a pro basketball game? Well, what I'm proposing to pay for these boat dive trips is just about at the outer limit of what I'm willing to spend for what I'm getting. I'd pay $25 to $35 (US) for a decent mid-range toaster, but not more. So when I'm told I may have to tip the crew of the boat heavily because they are working without a wage, that's a problem for me. It would be sort of like paying $125 per seat to get into pro basketball game and then being told I have to generously tip all the staff I encounter inside because they are all working for no wages, so as to enjoy the privilege of getting in free to pro basketball game.

 

[Damselfish]

Most people hate the US driven tipping culture, which is hardly specific to dive boats. In a way its not all that much different from tipping your poorly paid waiter in a restaurant.

By definition a tip is optional. Do what you can or want to...or don’t. But its not worth losing sleep over. Now if you want to dive warm water and spend less money doing it, there are ways. (Going to Cayman to boat dive is NOT one of them.

 

[TMHeimer]

Now this is interesting - and I'd like to know more about it. I mean the way I'm looking at it, as customer (at least for this trip to the Caymans) is I'm paying what I consider to be a "full" price to go out on a two-tank boat trip. Now, I'm talking about value for money. How much would I pay for a toaster? How much for tickets to a pro basketball game? Well, what I'm proposing to pay for these boat dive trips is just about at the outer limit of what I'm willing to spend for what I'm getting. I'd pay $25 to $35 (US) for a decent mid-range toaster, but not more. So when I'm told I may have to tip the crew of the boat heavily because they are working without a wage, that's a problem for me. It would be sort of like paying $125 per seat to get into pro basketball game and then being told I have to generously tip all the staff I encounter inside because they are all working for no wages, so as to enjoy the privilege of getting in free to pro basketball game.

I agree with Damselfish's post. And you make a very good point as well. There are many threads on tipping, with the usual result of "it really varies around the World".
I always like to compare scuba instructors who work for low pay, and particularly those DMs who work for tips and shop perks, to musicians.
You're supposed to like leading dives or assisting with courses because scuba is FUN. You're an accomplished musician with college degrees, etc. but you should do it for free because music is FUN. The waiter/waitress is not in that job for fun.
Same thing for the people who work in the stadium you paid $125 to get into. They get salary, no tips.
"Your R & B Band should play our lounge in exchange for free beer and exposure--a lot of people come here". But no salary--hey, music is fun.
It's all very interesting the DM thing. Too bad so many are willing to do it without an owner-paid salary--even minimum wage.

 

[Jonn]

Every dive is a solo dive. Diving is a solitary activity we (usually) do together. The buddy and the DM might help you out of trouble, or they might not. It’s not exactly a safe hobby at the best of times, and things can go bad fast. When you belly up to the desk with your C-card, you (and especially the card) are saying “I am a real scuba diver”. The implication is that you are fully qualified to select and inspect your gear, don it, get in the water, do the dive, respond to emergencies, and rescue your guide if THEY need it. They’re a guide, not a nanny. It might not be a realistic expectation for a vacation diver doing two tanks a year, but that’s the theory. A valet service will hump your tanks down the dock and grab your valve when you climb back in the boat (so annoying!), but they’re not really taking responsibility for you underwater. Consult the liability waiver if you’re unclear on this point.

If you doubt your own ability (and congratulations for knowing that if you do!), make that clear upfront. Communication is key to the DM relationship, like any other. Tell them what you need, and be willing to pay for it. No operator wants a customer to ever feel pushed into a dive, or nervous, or unsafe! If you take a course, even just a refresher, you change from “qualified diver” to “student” and everything changes. Then the implication is that you CAN’T safely do the dive, and the instructor IS responsible for you. PADI has a million little courses; Put Another Dollar In, have a fun and educational dive under the full attention of a professional, and bring home a pretty card!

 

[caydiver]

If you haven’t been diving for 30 years a full refresher or activation course is advisable. Many will not take you without it and hopefully you would want it because it is safest way to get you back in the water. Your wife can do e-learning or a referral or even the full cert here. When the courses are done you will be able to take advantage of wall diving etc here. I would suggest that you contact a local dive company (in whatever locale you are actually visiting) and ask them what that can offer you in terms of timing etc. It can be confusing if you are looking for specific information in a location and you are getting information about places that do not have bearing on where you are going.
With regard to tipping whether or not you like it, it is a super easy thing to avoid. Just don’t go to a place where it is part of fabric for those in the service industry and you don’t even have to think about it. I don’t like anchovies but don’t complain about them, just avoid dishes that are prepared with them. I don’t knock the chefs that make them, don’t maintain they shouldn’t be used and don’t slam those who enjoy them. Personally I don’t mind rewarding someone who has made an experience special for me. Doesn’t make me right or you wrong. It simply is what it is.

 

[seeker242]

Later when I moved to the Florida Keys I never, on multiple boat trips (for the company I worked for) saw a divemaster get in the water, they just cut you loose while they ate sandwiches on boat

That is still the case in the majority of south FL and it's not really a problem. A lot of people don't want a guide.For people that do, they are usually available for hire.

 

[Neilwood]

Ya, you've all been incredibly helpful and patient and I really do appreciate it. One thing you need to appreciate is the variables involved for me (and my wife) on this trip - I want to dive deep over a wall, but haven't dived for 30 years, so I got to get back up to speed, and my wife wans to take OW, down there in Caymans, on this trip, for first time. Add in the peculiarities of Cayman diving spelled out by caydiver above, and my varying experiences on boats and with divemasters, etc., and it's all a little mind boggling. By I'm finally beginning to get a leg over it.

I guess most of your are serious hobbyists and a lot of this is "been there, done that" for you, but I'm just trying to set the table for a good initial trip for me and my wife. Yes I'm aware of the risks of over-thinking and over-planning, but the other factor is it's snowy and cold where I live right now and it's just plain fun to engage with, and chat about, scuba again. I enjoy these forums. Thanks again.

Based on this, I would suggest (as other have) that you do a refresher or even another OW course (there are likely quite a few changes to the content of the course now compared to when you did it). Last thing you want/need on your wife's first dives are for there to be an issue and your skills are too rusty.
I would try to get your wife to do the theory and pool work done at home with a referral for the OW. That way you spend as little time indoors doing boring stuff on holiday - you get to get out in the water pretty much straight away.

WRT tips - this appears to be an American thing. In most of the rest of the world, we tip but only as recognition of great service. The staff are paid a wage and the tips are extra. If I don't tip the staff don't go home unpaid. The whole idea of "mandatory" tipping as you seem to have there is effectively a hidden charge for any service.
An example here of dive boats -you pay your money for the trip, you take your gear on the boat, you set it up and you dive (without guide normally), you secure your gear and you offload it after the dive. If a deckhand decided to assist me with any of that, I would consider tipping him as that is service above and beyond the requirement ( I have not paid the boat to perform any of those services).