How often do most shops in your area require Nitrox tanks to be O2 cleaned?

[mike_s]

I think $75 to O2 clean the tank and valve is a bit on the high side, but not by much. When you look at the time required to drain the tank, clean it, dry it, disassemble, clean and reassemble the valve with new parts, inspect the tank and then fill it, you are talking about a labor intensive process.

Even a regular visual inspection takes time and it is not like you can do other things while you are inspecting the tank. If you compare the hourly rate to what mechanics, plumbers, electricians, etc charge, then it does not seem that out of line.

.

I agree that if you look at hourly costs that o2 cleaning should just cost $20 bucks for example.

But I was just saying $75 is high (per tank) compared to what you normally see shops charge. Shops would charge more if they could get it for example.

But I agree with you in comparison of hourly rates....

I often see people whine about what regualtor service (labor) costs. Which typically is an hour or two job by a competent tech and costs about $50 to $60 bucks at most shops (for labor). I tell them to try to get a plumber for under $60 bucks an hour and he's just making your toliet flush, not working on gear that supports your breathing.

My shop charges something $20 or $30 bucks to o2 clean a tank. (I can't remember exact amount). I don't think they are making a profit off that amount with the time, materials/chemicals, and equipment/tumblers involved. (I don't think that price includes a complete valve rebuilt for exmaple though... that would be more).

For the record, anyone who tells you a steel tank is full of rust, without looking inside 1st, should be avoided. As my niece likes to say "Run away bravely

Yup.

 

[danktex]

But where are you going to get your fills when this shop goes out of business due to you no longer paying for O2 cleaning ?

Goes out of business because I am not paying for O2 cleaning they are charging for and not doing? Do we need shops like this around. I also got a couple instances of bad air. Should I consider myself lucky that some of their air was good.

That shop does not exist anymore and I can afford a compressor.:mooner: But I still get my fills and some of my equipment locally.

 

[texdiveguy]

JessH... you are not going to get many folks to commit to a time frame as there are a host of variables that are to be considered. As one might say--'it all depends'.

 

[Wookie]

BTW most shops test their air after changing filters........

Please provide your evidence for this... Any dive shop I have ever asked this specific question to says that they test banked air... I test banked air also, and would never bother to change $150 worth of filters just to get better air test results. If I have less that OCA, something is wrong and needs to be fixed.

Frank

 

[k-valve]

Where, exactly, did you get the wisdom that lead you to these conclusions?

Phil Ellis

First of all, lose your smart@ss attitude. I'm the last person you're gonna run acroos who will take crap from some PADI DM who happens to work in a dive shop. I guess we're all supposed to respect your advice because you sell unnecessary equipment to newbie recreational divers, or because you have 1000 dives to 30'. Yep, that's right, mensa boy...I checked your profile. You have zero technical diving certs, but you are a manager of a and DM for one more Put Another Dollar In dive shop. Wow! Impressive credentials.

That said, right off the bat I question not only your experience, expertise and motive. As many technical divers will tell you...there are a whole lot of dive shop owners, managers and employees that don't know squat about technical diving. Appraently that includes you too, genius. While you are clearly among the minority of dive shop owners who are happy to screw every patron you have out of every penny you can, the facts are the facts. An O2 clean tank does not have to be O2 cleaned every year. Sure it helps line your pockets, but let me clue you in...we're not here to line your pockets.

Regarding Grade E air... Try reading up on OSHA and CGA guidelines. You've heard of those agencies, right? You talk a big game about ppm, but can you even conceptualize what that means? I mean a whole million???? That's an awful lot to think about for a good ol' Alabama boy like yourself. Grade E air is considered O2 clean. Check the air quality reports on your shop's compressor...you do that don't you, have your compressor gas tested???? Your shop's reports should say what grade your air is.

UV light testing. Anyone who can do a decent VIP on a tank should be able to see most indications that would point toward a required O2 cleaning. After that, use a UV light to look for other contaminants that fluoresce. If nothing shows then the tank is clean enough for O2 use. Sorry that won't add a chunk of cash to your register, but that's the way it is.

Don't start talking to me about parts per million either Einstein. Have you heard of the fire triangle? If someone has been using a tank that was previously O2 cleaned and it passes a VIP and a UV screening then something is missing that would start a fire homeboy...fuel. Without it you have no fire, so you're unknowledgable PADI guideline following, money grubbing little self is safe when you're filling that tank.

Now I'm just talking about tanks here...not regs or valves. Those are different animals.

So, pal, you keep telling your customers that they need their tanks O2 cleaned annually. But don't let them talk to someone with real world applications. Don't let them talk to a technical diver. Don't let them on the Internet. Make sure they continue to chant the PADI (Put Another Dollar In) mantra and reading the PADI recreational manuals. That'll keep your coffers full.

If you want to follow the word of PADI then by all means, follow the word of PADI...which is an agency that doesn't know squat about technical diving...they do however know all about covering their butts. Well you may have heard of this obscure agency called OSHA. There's another called CGA. You might want to look into the regs for breathable air.

 

[mike_s]

UV light testing. Anyone who can do a decent VIP on a tank should be able to see most indications that would point toward a required O2 cleaning. After that, use a UV light to look for other contaminants that fluoresce. If nothing shows then the tank is clean enough for O2 use.

huh?

Kvalve, can you give a reference to what this is based on?

I mean I've never seen anything or anyone say that just because you can't see something with a UV light that a tank is clean enough for O2 use?

 

[PhilEllis]

First of all, lose your smart@ss attitude. I'm the last person you're gonna run acroos who will take crap from some PADI DM who happens to work in a dive shop. I guess we're all supposed to respect your advice because you sell unnecessary equipment to newbie recreational divers, or because you have 1000 dives to 30'. Yep, that's right, mensa boy...I checked your profile. You have zero technical diving certs, but you are a manager of a and DM for one more Put Another Dollar In dive shop. Wow! Impressive credentials.

That said, right off the bat I question not only your experience, expertise and motive. As many technical divers will tell you...there are a whole lot of dive shop owners, managers and employees that don't know squat about technical diving. Appraently that includes you too, genius. While you are clearly among the minority of dive shop owners who are happy to screw every patron you have out of every penny you can, the facts are the facts. An O2 clean tank does not have to be O2 cleaned every year. Sure it helps line your pockets, but let me clue you in...we're not here to line your pockets.

Regarding Grade E air... Try reading up on OSHA and CGA guidelines. You've heard of those agencies, right? You talk a big game about ppm, but can you even conceptualize what that means? I mean a whole million???? That's an awful lot to think about for a good ol' Alabama boy like yourself. Grade E air is considered O2 clean. Check the air quality reports on your shop's compressor...you do that don't you, have your compressor gas tested???? Your shop's reports should say what grade your air is.

UV light testing. Anyone who can do a decent VIP on a tank should be able to see most indications that would point toward a required O2 cleaning. After that, use a UV light to look for other contaminants that fluoresce. If nothing shows then the tank is clean enough for O2 use. Sorry that won't add a chunk of cash to your register, but that's the way it is.

Don't start talking to me about parts per million either Einstein. Have you heard of the fire triangle? If someone has been using a tank that was previously O2 cleaned and it passes a VIP and a UV screening then something is missing that would start a fire homeboy...fuel. Without it you have no fire, so you're unknowledgable PADI guideline following, money grubbing little self is safe when you're filling that tank.

Now I'm just talking about tanks here...not regs or valves. Those are different animals.

So, pal, you keep telling your customers that they need their tanks O2 cleaned annually. But don't let them talk to someone with real world applications. Don't let them talk to a technical diver. Don't let them on the Internet. Make sure they continue to chant the PADI (Put Another Dollar In) mantra and reading the PADI recreational manuals. That'll keep your coffers full.



If you want to follow the worfd of PADIAll they do is follow the word of PADI...which is an agency that doesn't know squat about technical diving...they do however know all about covering their butts. You might want to go and checkWell you may have heard of this obscure agency called OSHA. There's another called CGA. You might want to

Well, I don't even know where to start......so, I will just leave this alone. Were I you, I wouldn't depend on profiles on ScubaBoard to tell me much about the qualifications, skills, and experiences of a board member. That can make you an asshat.

Phil Ellis

 

[danktex]

Please provide your evidence for this... Any dive shop I have ever asked this specific question to says that they test banked air... I test banked air also, and would never bother to change $150 worth of filters just to get better air test results. If I have less that OCA, something is wrong and needs to be fixed.

Frank

I don't have any video if that is what you are looking for. My point is if someone has an air test that shows clean air, that only means the air was clean at the time the test was done. That is why I do O2 cleaning on a yearly basis. You just can't know and it is better to be safe than sorry especially when I am having someone else do the filling.

From what I understand you run an exceptional operation. Just because you would not consider doing something unscrupulous never assume the same from others.

 

[Wookie]

I don't have any video if that is what you are looking for. My point is if someone has an air test that shows clean air, that only means the air was clean at the time the test was done. That is why I do O2 cleaning on a yearly basis. You just can't know and it is better to be safe than sorry especially when I am having someone else do the filling.

From what I understand you run an exceptional operation. Just because you would not consider doing something unscrupulous never assume the same from others.

I'm with you here. I O2 clean all my cylinders (50 or so any year) each year, and I know who puts the gas in them. More importantly, I O2 clean and rebuild my valves each year. I get excited when I hear that "most shops change filters prior to air testing". I have no evidence that "most" shops do or don't, I'm sure some shops do, and I'm sure some shops pump bad air, too. As I've stated in the past, anyone who doesn't look at the shops air test deserves whatever they get in the tank, not that a piece of paper guarantees good air.

 

[texdiveguy]

As I've stated in the past, anyone who doesn't look at the shops air test deserves whatever they get in the tank, not that a piece of paper guarantees good air.

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