Question Hollis Prism 2 - Advice & Tips

[Mas.]

Your family friend needs to think about a business strategy. Going with an established unit may not be the best option if the target market is saturated.

Did not ask for my opinion. Just asked for help to know what is available in the market that match their preference. I know they will be around university students of marine cinema, marine science, scientific divers, and wealthy urbanite.

The SF2 is CE and is made by a decent, stable institution.

Thanks. The guy who makes the SF2 describes their business as a humble operation, he always talks about the challenge he faces from skeptics in the diving community doubting he would be able to successfully operate a device as complex as a CCR rebreather in the CE market.

 

[JackZwykle]

Yes, if they want only from the larger business. These are the only two units I am aware of so far. But i am searching for more options to help a family student who want to start instructor career in CCR training and doesn't want to consider any units rely on the mood and life conditions of single engineer or entrepreneur.

Please share if you are aware of any other CE models available from any other decent and stable institution.

1. Poseidon, on the market since 1950s. Although would not recommend for outside of Europe (support) and Se7en probably not everyone's cup of tea.

2. SF2 - apart from a small but stable org producing it, it's more reliant on its Shearwater controller than SF, as most of the rebreather is made of off-the shelf components, easy to replace / re-machine or just unbreakable. So even if SF2 shuts down one day - you're fine. But again - a very specific unit, not everyone likes its bellows config, relatively small number of units around.

What I think was mentioned here before - there's no real mass produced CCR on the market and won't be for some time. We're in an equivalent of barnstorming era of aviation.
There's no model and no company that guarantees 20 years on the market, none. Mares-rEvo, Poseidon may give a good chance, but absolutely no guarantee, especially about a specific model (see what happened to Hollis units on buyout).

But what you're missing the most I think is - an instructor should train on a unit that has training demand in his area - so it's popular in this area, otherwise he will never have students for his oh-so-corporate-and-forever unit.
Additionally - I don't know a single instructor personally who would be single-unit certified. A CCR instructor can and should be able to cross to another unit when market demands it.

 

[telemonster]

Hello! I have a Prism2! My friend (Hey stuartv!) noticed it here on Scubaboard at a decent price so I bought it. I was after the canbus shearwater controllers, and I could get local training. I had an Inspiration with Hammerhead upgrade kit that I bought before training and never could find an instructor. Sold it.

My has the original front mount counterlungs. They call this FMCL versus BMCL (Backmount.)

So I can give my take on my likes/hates. I don't care about the CE thing, and I think all CCR's are overpriced given the good sold.

Likes:

1. Decent flood resistance, FMCL version. The hoses are separate where they feed the CL and I think this does it good if you were to dump water into it.

2. Pretty well made. Aluminum housing for the control electronics. The plastic parts for me have held up well but are starting to wear a bit.

3. CANBus shearwater electronics. Nice computer, but all of the Shearwaters are at fault for not having a vibrate or beeping function when in red. Only available on the brand new ones which are overpriced.

4. Super comfy WOB. I have a military o2 unit also that is chest mount and it's pretty bad WOB versus the prism2.

5. Can be had fairly cheap used

6. The clear housing over the scrubber. Can see if water is in it. Can see if sorb is in it.

Room for improvement:

1. Parts made in China I believe, but replacement parts savings not passed onto users. Would be nice to get replacement parts at a fair price, but they gouge you on them. Like all things Scuba, thus it's a dying hobby.

2. Shearwaters don't beep or vibrate, but that is because all of them are defective except the Petrel 3.

3. You have to buy a stand. It doesn't sit upright without it. Prone to tumbling forward or backwards. Get a stand.

4. Afraid of wear on the plastic threaded parts. The BOV is plastic, and where the hoses connect to the counterlungs on the FMCL version are threaded plastic. The FMCLs are expensive to replace. I just make sure to not cross thread them.

5. Sometimes you can hit the manual ADV (Air) add with the hoses when moving around based on where it sits on the counterlung.

6. FMCL crowd the chest. The BMCL look cooler and keep the front D rings exposed.

7. Revo temp monitoring system / Tempstick from AP is a really good idea. Not applicable to the Prism2.

8. The nuts that connect hoses to the back scrubber -- normally need to bump them loose with a screwdriver covered in cloth, or 3d printed tool that people make. Not a big deal but a thing.

9. I have a hard time doing o2 flush to check current limiting. The o2 addition is slow. I am told people remove a restrictor to make it faster, but I haven't done this yet.

10. There are these drool drains on the counterlungs. I think they should have done some kind of little squeeze pump versus a simple drain. Then you could bilge out all the slobber, and perhaps shoot it at your dive buddy when back on land.

With all of these units it can be a bit of a pain when it comes to replacement parts. My local dealers are hit or miss, but there is some place in Philly that I have ordered things from and they were cool. The one local dealer never deals, the other shop is open like 18 hours a week. This is a problem with all units.

 

[gordonscuba]

Hello! I have a Prism2! My friend (Hey stuartv!) noticed it here on Scubaboard at a decent price so I bought it. I was after the canbus shearwater controllers, and I could get local training. I had an Inspiration with Hammerhead upgrade kit that I bought before training and never could find an instructor. Sold it.

The Prism2 is a good, reliable unit. I think your post is pretty much spot on, but couldn't help but notice that the positives you listed are extremely important, major things such as WOB or build quality, whereas the negatives are generally minor things that have a simple solution (e.g. 3D print some small simple thing, and the problem goes away).

Also: I hate anything beeping or vibrating, so I consider that a feature that they don't. I think rebreather divers must be situationally aware enough to monitor their controllers. First thing I did when I got my first Petrel 3 was turn off ALL vibration.

 

[mr_v]

The Prism2 is a good, reliable unit. I think your post is pretty much spot on, but couldn't help but notice that the positives you listed are extremely important, major things such as WOB or build quality, whereas the negatives are generally minor things that have a simple solution (e.g. 3D print some small simple thing, and the problem goes away).

To be fair... only the fifth point - "pretty cheap" - may be the main differentiator between Prism 2 and other units with the same positive characteristics.

 

[iain/hsm]

One major factor an individual sports diver needs to consider before buying a current recreational sports rebreather is when you realise these product are mainly sold now in support of retailers and instructors and the realisation dawns that your twenty years too late starting.

Pretty much similar to regulator spare parts not being sold to end users its the manufactures tacit support to it's distributor and dive shop network for them to make free cost support nothing more

All recreational rebreathers without exception the Mares Hollis Poseidon etc are all the product from a position of being what is known as a Flagship Product

In a declining recreational cottage industry all three above were desperate for a flagship product by which they could hang all the cheap tat from China the masks fins snorkels knives wet suit rash suits and gear bags in the various portfolios. As the decline of each regulator sales took its toll on these companies.

That and killing off more customers than days in a year didn't help things either.

The recreational market for rebreathers is pretty much dead in the water and the customer base pretty much led the way..........literally.

 

[BoltSnap]

One major factor an individual sports diver needs to consider before buying a current recreational sports rebreather is when you realise these product are mainly sold now in support of retailers and instructors and the realisation dawns that your twenty years too late starting.

Pretty much similar to regulator spare parts not being sold to end users its the manufactures tacit support to it's distributor and dive shop network for them to make free cost support nothing more

All recreational rebreathers without exception the Mares Hollis Poseidon etc are all the product from a position of being what is known as a Flagship Product

In a declining recreational cottage industry all three above were desperate for a flagship product by which they could hang all the cheap tat from China the masks fins snorkels knives wet suit rash suits and gear bags in the various portfolios. As the decline of each regulator sales took its toll on these companies.

That and killing off more customers than days in a year didn't help things either.

The recreational market for rebreathers is pretty much dead in the water and the customer base pretty much led the way..........literally.

Do you have real and verified data to support your BS?

 

[iain/hsm]

Do you have real and verified data to support your BS?

Glad to.
Which part would you like first the killing of more divers than days in the year
or the sole purpose of a rebreather is for a Flagship Product

 

[mr_v]

One major factor an individual sports diver needs to consider before buying a current recreational sports rebreather is when you realise these product are mainly sold now in support of retailers and instructors and the realisation dawns that your twenty years too late starting.

Pretty much similar to regulator spare parts not being sold to end users its the manufactures tacit support to it's distributor and dive shop network for them to make free cost support nothing more

All recreational rebreathers without exception the Mares Hollis Poseidon etc are all the product from a position of being what is known as a Flagship Product

In a declining recreational cottage industry all three above were desperate for a flagship product by which they could hang all the cheap tat from China the masks fins snorkels knives wet suit rash suits and gear bags in the various portfolios. As the decline of each regulator sales took its toll on these companies.

That and killing off more customers than days in a year didn't help things either.

The recreational market for rebreathers is pretty much dead in the water and the customer base pretty much led the way..........literally.

I don't have a game in the Prism market... But the statement above is a load of BS. It makes me wonder if the author is a bot. To think of that, this is some serious load of garbage that typically comes from banned accounts.

 

[davehicks]

Also: I hate anything beeping or vibrating, so I consider that a feature that they don't. I think rebreather divers must be situationally aware enough to monitor their controllers. First thing I did when I got my first Petrel 3 was turn off ALL vibration.

Literally the only reason to get a Petrel 3 over a Petrel 2. The haptic alarms!