Have tech divers equaled or surpassed what can be accomplished by US Navy divers?

[slackercruster]

Are you motivated by ego?

That's frightening.

I think ego is a big factor with anyone looking to bust records and find glory.

Hell, an ego fueled life is pretty much how we humans live. The only frightening part is when 'an ego' takes a life or lives early if that person's ego was more judicious.

But in the end it is all up to how a person wishes 'to spend' their life.

 

[slackercruster]

Not me. I've never considered myself a tech diver. Regardless of what I was, these days I'm just a vacation diver.

If you don't want to call it ego, call it whatever you want. I don't think Tech Divers follow orders, and they don't have to worry about getting fired either. Whatever it is that motivates the Tech diver is different.

Well, successful tech divers follow 'orders of physics' or they rewrite the book or die in the process. Navy divers not only have to follow laws of physics but they got laws from egos on their back too.

I was talking with some cave divers in High Springs. Some of em got into caves cause it was the only local diving available to them. Guess I would too if I lived there after I got bored with the limited open water and cavern spring dives.

I prefer recreational diving as well. I like Hogarthian diving and that is as far into tech as I get. If the dive is not fun I ask why am I doing it? I dive for fun.

High Springs aside, tech diving seems to draw the type of person that likes complications and refinements of skills and technology. Another faction of tech likes pushing limits or new exploration. Lots of things motivate tech diving and I don't pretend to know them all. But 'being first at something' is in the minds of a lot of em.

For me I don't like all the hassles, don't want to pee in my drysuit or wear depends and like to be comfortable. And Tri mix...that stuff is expensive $60 to $100 a fill for doubles! I couldn't afford to dive much of that stuff.

But my hat is off to all the tech divers that have helped advance scuba to what it is today.

 

[MikeFerrara]

I was told the Navy invented Tri mix. The private sector took it and built upon it. Was wondering if the Navy is always in the lead or if the private sector has caught up with any advancements and practices that originated from the navy.

It's before my time in diving but I think the military had the first helium decompression tables and weren't sharing them.

I've heard different stories concerning who did the first civilian helium dives...one suggested it was Hal Watts who used it in a reovery attempt where I think he got bent and another was some diver at Cannonball cave in Missouri.

In either case, I know divers who were doing trimix dives back when they had to pay somebody like Hamilton to cut custom tables for them.

I think it's already been stated but comparing the diving we do to military diving is apples to oranges. I'm sure the military has some advanced tricks up their sleeve but I don't think you'll see them doing the depths, times or penetrations that we do with comparable equipment and facilities.

Additionally, I think you'll find the skill sets of the divers quite different. Put a military diver in a small silty cave or tight wreck and, unless they are also a trained/experience cave diver the likely result will be a silty mess...never mind the fact that the cave or wreck dive will require the diver to plan and control all his own lagistics and diving.

 

[ComputerJoe]

Don't forget that Navy and Commercial divers have a deco chamber available to them seconds after surfacing. You can get away with taking more chances if you have a safety net to fall into.

IANTD tech encyclopedia has some good chapters written on commercial diving procedures. I believe I read that commercial diving did the expirementation with Heliox/trimix and because commercial divers had to be profitable commercial interests found using trimix and diminishing HPNS more cost effective than trying to eliminating narcosis entirely. I think that the navy and commercial interests were both very interested in what the other was doing and seperating them would be impossible.

 

[DennisS]

The commercial divers do depths and times with saturation diving that a tech diver without a support system could never do. The navy and commercial diving programs are funded with millions, tech divers are funded with thousands.

If the Navy needed to get a mile or two into a cave and back out, they would do it. My guess would be that they have probably sent some divers through cave diving certifications. If there was a couple million in treasure in the back of a cave, the commercial companies would have been there and gone years ago. The navy doesn't use balls of string for navigation, it's called inertial navigation. Their navigation displays in the diver delivery vehicles are so sophisticated, even when turned off, are classified. They have the technology, toys, funding and experience to do things under water that a tech diver would have wet dreams about.

Tech divers are sophisticated recreational divers doing it for a hobby. The wkpp has accomplished incredible feats. They're not in the same league as the navy and commercial sector though.

 

[hobodiver]

Bingo! They were testing a suit and it appears that it works.

Navy Diver Sets Record with 2,000 foot Dive

That appears to be using one of those 1 atmosphere suits. More like going down in a submarine than diving if you ask me.

 

[Doubler]

For the uninformed, Navy diving covers a myriad of disciplines that civilian tech divers don't come close too. First off let me say that tech divers have my greatest respect as most of the modern innovations in recreational scuba came from the tech diving community however the Navy Experimental Dive Unit provides the dive tables and decompression tables we all use. Many Navy divers have been seriously injured or died providing these tables. Navy diving is basically divided into three disciplines: Salvage and repair, Explosive Ordnance Disposal and SEALs. It was Navy Salvage divers that recovered the remains of the Astronauts on Space Shuttle Challenger. While I might not go in a cave with a SEAL, I definitely wouldn't go into combat or a bomb disposal mission with a Cave Diver. I personally know Navy divers that have done SAT diving below 750 feet, I personally know EOD divers that have defused world war II bombs in 50 feet of water. There is no comparison between Navy and Civilian diving except that it all takes place underwater.

 

[Tortuga68]

There is no comparison between Navy and Civilian diving except that it all takes place underwater

I agree there's no point comparing them; but IMHO both have done things that the others haven't, and never will, because the motivations are different

 

[Doubler]

Tortuga 68 you are 100% correct in your assessment.

 

[terrydive1]

I completely agree with you guys also. I get the perspective of both worlds as a civilian dive business owner and a reservists EOD diver. When I'm here teaching, my goal is to introduce someone to diving or further their education. Last year when I was deployed to Dubai for force protection dives, my job was to look for explosives underwater. I wore the same gear and used the same techniqes for diving, just had a different objective in the end. I had the opportunity to go through NDSTC 5 years ago after I had already been a civilian dive instructor for a few years. (btw, you don't mention that down there!!). As the education does not differ from civilain diving, you will leave there much stronger!! Pool week was the highest attrition rate in any class. While I witnessed guys who had years of civilian diving experience DOR (drop on request), I saw others who had never breathed bubbles a day in their life make it through just fine. Did they necessarily have better dive skills? No, they just were able to take the "beatings" and handled the pressure of the moment better than the other guy (or gal). As to answer the tech diving question from the beginning, I think both the Navy diving community and the Tech divers are on top of their perspective games. Again, great divers and techniques in both communities, just two different goals in the end.