Gloucester Dive Flag Law Update

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Hello

After reading thru this post Im wondering if the issue is that they are going to prohibit shore diving in Glouster or is the issue that they will require each diver to have a flag. Could someone update the board members on what issue is exactly at hand. Someone mentioned no shore diving and Im wondering if thats the case.

Or what is the exact ordinence that was passed. Im getting the impression its more serious than each diver having to carry a flag.

Thanks
 
ScubaSarus:
Hello

After reading thru this post Im wondering if the issue is that they are going to prohibit shore diving in Glouster or is the issue that they will require each diver to have a flag. Could someone update the board members on what issue is exactly at hand. Someone mentioned no shore diving and Im wondering if thats the case.

Or what is the exact ordinence that was passed. Im getting the impression its more serious than each diver having to carry a flag.

Thanks
I believe the "no shore diving" is not that they will prohibit shore diving per se. But that it would not be possible to shore dive, practically speaking, without being within 25 feet of a trap - since traps blanket pretty much everyplace you'd want to dive.
 
Do we know exactly who are the sponsors for the regulation. ie. Who is pushing it and what is their agenda?
What are the real underlying reasons for this regulation.
Is this about safety?
Are the residents complaining about too many divers and their impact on their property?
Are lobstermen complaining about specific issues?
Have there been any documented accidents / injuries that will be prevented by this new regulation?
I have heard about this, but have never understood what it was really about.

I does appear that if someone wanted to string lobster traps along a popular shore diving spot that they could effectively shut it down and that would be a very bad thing for diving in Massachusetts.
 
I think a good idea would be to organize all SCUBA divers in New England into a Political Action Committee (PAC), register the committee with the Secretary of State's Office; raise boo-koo $$ and start taking some action with the STATE politicians.... this fight should be fought, in my humble opinon, as a POLITICAL issue and $$ talks. Right now, the lobstermen have the $$.

If divers wait for the so called regulation to be enforced, there will be no turning it back without major financial obligations.. don't wait, organize a political action committee, throw some - a lot - of $$ at the Gloucester state senator and state reps... make an appointment to go into Boston or their local office and speak with them...be prepaired to tell them how many divers the organization represents, how much revenue divers bring into their districts and how many divers in the pac / organization (a) vote and (b) live in their district(s). Politicians only understand 2 things..... MONEY and VOTES... niether of which divers have right now as an organized group!!!

I've had over 13 years in Massachusetts politics... don't wait until they've stripped us of the "right" to dive!!!

Pete
 
As copied from an e-mail received from the BSC

Bay State Council of Divers - Meeting for the “Dive Industry”
< Meeting Minutes for October 11, 2006 >

The meeting was held at the Crowne Plaza Hotel in Natick, MA. The meeting came to order at 7:45 PM. (Minutes taken by Mary Howard)

Angelo Correnti welcomed those in attendance and gave a brief AGENDA:
1. History and update – Angelo Correnti
2. Steve Coren to fill in regarding meeting with the City of Gloucester
on the first Wednesday of October
3. Matthew Lawrence to update on SBNMS Management Plan and review.
4. Other updates and comments

1 - HISTORY:
Dave Stillman, owner of Cape Ann Divers in Gloucester, had received informational leaflets with the Gloucester ordinance relative to SCUBA diving regulations. He called Angelo 3-4 months ago after going back and forth with the City of Gloucester to try to reconcile the situation on his own.
The Bay State Council met 2 months ago and retained Steve Coren as legal counsel for the BSC to work on behalf of divers in this case. (Mr. Coren worked with the BSC on a previous case in Nahant in 1983.)
Fred Calhoun met with the Gloucester Waterways Board after that meeting. State Police, the City attorney and Charter Boat captains were at the meeting, as was Mr. Coren. Mr. Calhoun tried to get the point across to the committee that requiring each diver to carry a flag was dangerous for divers and unhelpful to lobstermen.
On October 3, 2006, Angelo Correnti attended a meeting of the Atlantic Marine Fisheries Committee. Angelo is a member of the board of that Committee. During a break of the meeting, Angelo talked with a Marshfield lobsterman, also on the committee, who asked why this issue has come up now. It was explained that a lobsterman in Gloucester went to the harbormaster and asked why the ordinance, which has been on the books for a while, was not being enforced, and requested that it be enforced.

To date the BSC had raised about $4200 from individual divers, dive clubs and shops. This is a start, but will not be enough if we need to go to court. – It was noted that Mr. Coren had reduced his fee for the BSC to less than half his normal rate. (Approximately $1300 more was raised at the meeting.)

2 - STEVE COREN, UPDATE:
On Wednesday, October 4, Steve Coren met with representatives of the City of Gloucester and the Waterways Board.
A lot has happened since the last BSC meeting. Mr. Coren has proposed that the City of Gloucester withdraw from their current position on enforcing the dive flag ordinance to require each diver to tow a flag.
On September 25th, there was a meeting with three members of the Waterways Board. The meeting was packed with divers, and the committee members were very polite and listened to the position put forward.
Steve Coren attended a meeting of the Waterways Board on October 4th. This time someone had made sure there were lobstermen present. Mr. Crossen (??) of the Board was in favor of keeping the ordinance enforced, as were 6 other members. Mr. Coren described the risks of the ordinance, and the risks to the city if they continued enforcing the ordinance, i.e. that they could be sued for restricting access to the water, which would be expensive for them. He also reviewed the change in the state law in 1978, which changed the wording from “Every scuba diver” to “Every scuba diver or group of scuba divers” in order to improve safety.
The Board was not interested in these arguments, but the Chairman of the Waterways Board was extremely interested in the facts of the Nahant case. Mr. Coren believes the town will not enforce the ordinance if it can be shown that a similar ordinance was previously struck down.
There was discussion of why the ordinance which was not previously enforced is now being enforced. Lobstermen have complained to the harbormaster; now divers may be cited.
Mr. Coren’s sense is that the ordinance will not be rescinded, but that Gloucester may cease to enforce it.
Mr. Coren has agreed to get copies of the 1983 Nahant case for the Waterways Board.
QUESTIONS/DISCUSSION included:
- How long to get the files from Salem District Court and what happens if they cannot be found? Answer: That depends.
- What is the Lobstermen’s issue? Answer: They are under a lot of pressure (competition, shell disease, collapsed stock), and yes, they do think divers steal from their traps.
- What is the status of the ordinance? Answer: It is possible that someone may be cited, in which case we will have a “test case”.
- What areas are under Gloucester jurisdiction in terms of the ordinance? Answer: Three miles.
- Issues of personal and property safety? Answer: You need to report all incidents of vandalism or threats to the police for the record. Get photos or videos if possible.
John Blackadar made a motion to give leeway to Mr. Coren to proceed as he sees fit. Motion was seconded and passed by a vote of those present. Angelo Correnti noted that this was not really an “industry” issue, and the next meeting of the BSC will be held on October 25 in Quincy.

4 - STELLWAGEN BANK NMS UPDATE - MATTHEW LAWRENCE
Matthew Lawrence, archeologist with the Stellwagen Bank National Marine Sanctuary, gave an update on the SBNMS Draft Management Plan. The Draft Management Plan is now underway and should be available for a public comment period soon. The Plan includes restrictions on diving in some areas of Stellwagen Bank to protect some of the shipwrecks located there. The public comment period will be a minimum of 30 days, allowing for comment from all concerned. It was noted that there will be TWO public comment periods before any restrictions are put into place. The upcoming one will be the first. After that there will be a revision of the PLAN and then another comment period. If you are an interested diver, please consider reading the Plan when it becomes available and offering your comments. For more information about the Draft Management Plan, and to send your contact information for notices, please check out the website at www.stellwagen.noaa.gov

5 - OTHER UPDATES AND COMMENTS
Fred Calhoun (Easy Diver) spoke briefly about his meeting with the Gloucester Waterways Board and the City of Gloucester. He noted that funding for basic services is a higher priority for Gloucester city officials at this time than discussing enforcement of a dive flag ordinance. Mr. Calhoun did note that if dive flags could be 25 feet from lobster buoys, and boats had to stay 50 feet away from dive flags, it could be difficult for lobstermen to pull traps if all divers had to tow a dive flag.
John Blackadar (SSN) noted that it is important for all those in attendance at this meeting to take the information back to their clubs and dive communities in order to keep divers informed about the Gloucester dive flag situation.
Wally Westphal (past president of BSC) has been in contact with the New Jersey reef people who have been able to put reefs and wrecks off their shores, adding over 3500 “reefs”. Wildlife HAS increased because of the added reef materials. Check out Wreck News publication.

Paul Adler (East Coast Divers) reminded divers to please support the Bay State Council’s Treasure Hunt Dive held every May at Stage Fort Park. All dive clubs, dive shops and individual divers should get together and be involved in this event.

THE NEXT MEETING OF THE BAY STATE COUNCIL WILL BE HELD ON OCTOBER 25, at the South Shore Neptunes’ Clubhouse in Quincy (at the corner of Quarry Street and Joyce Road) at 7:30PM.

ADDRESS FOR MAILING DONATIONS TO “THE CAUSE”
Bay State Council of Divers
c/o South Shore Neptunes
PO Box 518
Quincy, MA 02169
 
You gotta love it. The lobstermen demand that an ordinance that the town doesn't enforce be enforced and all of a sudden it's an issue. I'm sure if you looked hard enough, you'd find about ten town ordinances every lobsterman and his boat is violating on a daily basis.

One question....why might there be a need for a "test case"? It's my limited understanding that the SJC can review laws w/o their being an actual legal case(unlike the US Supreme Court which needs an actual case). I don't know how it gets to the SJC, but if a similar ordinance was defeated in Nahant, its seems like the issue has already been decided. From Gloucester's perspective, why bother?

LobstaMan
 
I would go for a modification that if a diver is lobstering one can not go near a trap but if recreationally diving you go anyplace. I hope they dont think we are freeing the lobsters on them.

Im not into lobsters and thats why I feel that way. We need to grab an inch then eventually grab a yard.
 
ScubaSarus:
I would go for a modification that if a diver is lobstering one can not go near a trap but if recreationally diving you go anyplace. I hope they dont think we are freeing the lobsters on them.

Im not into lobsters and thats why I feel that way. We need to grab an inch then eventually grab a yard.

It would be nice if someone would investigate that one lone lobsterman. I wonder if he has any family ties to the councilman or selecmen that are involved with trying to inforce this law.
 
STOGEY:
It would be nice if someone would investigate that one lone lobsterman. I wonder if he has any family ties to the councilman or selecmen that are involved with trying to inforce this law.

I don't get this. What does it matter if he has any ties to those responsible for enforcing the law currently on the books? That's not an abuse of power. Not at all the same as someone using family or friends to pass a NEW law that benefits them. Look, the problem isn't with those trying to get the law enforced, the problem is with the law. It's simply dangerous for divers. Just becomes Gloucester has decided not to enforce it, doesn't mean they can't or should (I hate the idea of selective law enforcement; just think what that could entail). If you see a bad law, don't ignore it, repeal it.
 
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