Four Russian divers missing in Egypt (Marsa Alam)

[GrimSleeper]

Ok, since these guys have been found and all is well, can I just let rip with one of my little bugbears?

Why oh why oh why is it impossible for anyone to be lost at sea without it being 'shark infested waters'? What on EARTH did sharks have to do with the incident? Did they make the divers surface away from the boat? No. Did sharks distract the boat crew so they missed the divers surfacing? No. Did sharks tow the divers 100km away from the reef? No. Did sharks eat the divers? No. DID THE DIVERS EVEN SEE A SHARK? Probably not.

When will reports focus on what actually causes these incidents (divers not knowing or not bothering with the right equipment and procedures for diving in strong current areas, boat crews who go to sleep the moment divers hit the water) rather than indulging in emotive nonsense about sharks?

It makes me quite cross... :doh2:

Grae

 

[ImParticipating]

Why oh why oh why is it impossible for anyone to be lost at sea without it being 'shark infested waters'?

Hmmm.....
"Several hundred sharks narrowly escaped serious injury during a rescue search in human-infested waters off Egypt. Injuries could have reached triple figures if the search had continued into peak traffic hours after daylight faded. Boat propellers "can cause severe cuts, amputate fins, and possibly even kill", according to experts at the The Maldives Whale Shark Project."

Nah, that'll never sell papers.


All joking aside - I'm glad all the divers survived.

EDIT: I shouldn't have made an off-topic joke on a thread about such a serious topic, and I apologise.
In the hopes of diverting a thread hijack let me clarify: 1) I'm merely amused at media reporting styles, and the fact that the public respond to media drama. So GrimSleeper's comment gave me a chuckle, and I shared my thought coz I haven't yet found the balance between forum-lurking and being talkative. Nuthin to see here, move along now.

 

[muha]

Sharks represent a real danger is such situation, and we should understand it:

CAIRO, June 2 2009 (Reuters) - A shark attacked and killed a French tourist diving (snorkel)in a remote site off Egypt's Red Sea coast on Tuesday, in the first fatal shark attack in the Arab country since 2004, state media and a French embassy official said.

"I can confirm that there is one French citizen killed by a shark in the Red Sea south of Marsa Alam," French embassy spokesman Jean-Marie Safa said.

The woman's leg showed visible bite marks, and she likely bled to death before being lifted to the surface, Egyptian state news agency MENA quoted a medical source as saying.

Marsa Alam is a remote southern dive spot on the Red Sea coast frequented by tourists hoping to avoid the crowds at more popular sites in the Sinai peninsula, where tourists flock in large numbers for the colourful coral reefs.

"This very rarely happens. It seems that the victim aggravated the shark or presented it with food, which caused a change in the shark's behaviour," MENA quoted Amr Ali, the president of the Society for the Preservation of the Red Sea Environment, as saying.

 

[GrimSleeper]

Sharks represent a real danger is such situation, and we should understand it:

CAIRO, June 2 2009 (Reuters) - A shark attacked and killed a French tourist diving (snorkel)in a remote site off Egypt's Red Sea coast on Tuesday, in the first fatal shark attack in the Arab country since 2004, state media and a French embassy official said.

"I can confirm that there is one French citizen killed by a shark in the Red Sea south of Marsa Alam," French embassy spokesman Jean-Marie Safa said.

The woman's leg showed visible bite marks, and she likely bled to death before being lifted to the surface, Egyptian state news agency MENA quoted a medical source as saying.

Marsa Alam is a remote southern dive spot on the Red Sea coast frequented by tourists hoping to avoid the crowds at more popular sites in the Sinai peninsula, where tourists flock in large numbers for the colourful coral reefs.

"This very rarely happens. It seems that the victim aggravated the shark or presented it with food, which caused a change in the shark's behaviour," MENA quoted Amr Ali, the president of the Society for the Preservation of the Red Sea Environment, as saying.

As I understood it, the victim in the 'attack' you are quoting was snorkelling while sharks were being chummed and/or fed. It's hardly the same thing. I dive with sharks pretty much every day, and you couldn't pay me enough to snorkel with them while there was fish blood in the water around me... Nobody's going to deny that deliberately aggravating sharks with food and then sticking tourists in the water with them can be dangerous. Well, the shark-feed ops might, I suppose... But the point is that sharks were NOT involved in the four Russian divers spending a night adrift.

It would be rather more useful to look at why, after years of this kind of incident, so many divers and operators ignore basic safety protocols. Is it so much to ask that divers carry a large, high-viz DSMB, a sonic signal and possibly a mirror? Is it so much to ask that dive charters have lookouts whose job is solely to watch for surfacing divers?

What we should 'understand' is the real causes of dive accidents (poor training and sloppy procedures, usually), rather than getting all over-excited because someone thought they saw a dorsal fin break the water once.

In case I didn't make it clear in the earlier post - glad everyone made it back. Uneaten.


Grae

 

[svs]

Chances to be eaten by shark in situation like this are small. More then 0 but small (I would guess in a single % range or less). Chances not to be found are around 50% (guess again).

 

[Jai Bar]

Chances to be eaten by shark in situation like this are small. More then 0 but small (I would guess in a single % range or less). Chances not to be found are around 50% (guess again).

Well, it is an area where Oceanic White Tips do come during the season. Although many divers meet sharks every day, meeting OWTs while drifting exhausted, dehydrated and debilitated after drifting 30 hours in open waters is a good way to become shark food. These sharks will definitely give a test-bite in a situation like this.

So, to summarize: while diving for fun I agree it is an almost null chance to get attacked by a Shark (even a curious OWT), while drifting for survival I'd guess it is more something like a 100% after a certain amount of time (48 hours? 60? whatever?).

I am not sure about the french tourist whether the nearby boat was chumming the OWTs that is perhaps rumor some claim it was others deny it. She was killed- it is 100% for sure.

 

[GrimSleeper]

Well, it is an area where Oceanic White Tips do come during the season. Although many divers meet sharks every day, meeting OWTs while drifting exhausted, dehydrated and debilitated after drifting 30 hours in open waters is a good way to become shark food. These sharks will definitely give a test-bite in a situation like this.

So, to summarize: while diving for fun I agree it is an almost null chance to get attacked by a Shark (even a curious OWT), while drifting for survival I'd guess it is more something like a 100% after a certain amount of time (48 hours? 60? whatever?).

I am not sure about the french tourist whether the nearby boat was chumming the OWTs that is perhaps rumor some claim it was others deny it. She was killed- it is 100% for sure.

Oh, I wish I'd never posted. I certainly wasn't trying to invite a load of made-up nonsense about why we should all be scared of sharks...

Too many people end up lost at sea from dive boats. Sharks are not the issue in these cases. Poor training, poor procedures and laziness seem to be the issue. So let's forget about our finny friends - at least those that still have fins - and ask ourselves why it is that something as simple as spotting a surfacing diver proves to be so difficult so often, and why it seems to happen in the Red Sea more than anywhere else. Or, we can just keep flapping about sharks...

Grae

 

[jkaterenchuk]

Well I still have my McMurdo PLB (Personal Locator Beacon) for sale just in case one of you "it could never happen to me" types decides its better safe than sorry.

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/cl...-being-lost-sea-emergency-locator-beacon.html

John

 

[whalerock]

It surprises me verytime I read something like that. i have been working as a guide there for 2 years and when you see divers diving this arae without SMB or just swimming out in the blue they risk their lives. Wde had a rule that every diver has to carry his own SMB, the zodiaks stay out when the divers are in the water. Apart from the current the current the dive site is very simple, follow the wall either on the lfet or the right hand site. The guides normally check the current before the briefing and than you go with zodiaks in small groups on the dive. The only place where you are a little bit of the riff is on the northern corner when you look for the cleaning station for grey reef sharks, but hey if you dont find the way back to the wall, end the dive and send the smb up straight away so that you are still in the area of the reef and the zodiak drivesr can see the smb.
Unfortunally often these simple rules are not followed because the diveoperation will not inforce tham. They dont have smb's available on board in case divers arrive without their own, inexperienced divers will be taken to the brothers or deadalus because its money, even if the law says they have to have at least 50 dives.
Accidents like this will be happen every year, fortunally this time nobody got hured.

Thomas

 

[Arizona]

Well I still have my McMurdo PLB (Personal Locator Beacon) for sale just in case one of you "it could never happen to me" types decides its better safe than sorry.

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/cl...-being-lost-sea-emergency-locator-beacon.html

John

Hi John

Bet you were just waiting to put that sales plug in once you heard they were all safe I am just joking Sounds like that would have helped quite a bit. Hope to see you in Thai waters again soon.

Vitali Vanov, wow what a story. Wonder if more particulars such as were they following the dive plan and what signaling devices if any they carried will come about. Glad to read everyone is safe.