First dive at 40 meters - Newbies recreational

[Dody]

The collection of gear or kit you dive with.

basically he is say8mg not to be over weighted.

btw where are you diving now?

For me (former oilfield engineer), it is an offshore platform .
I dive in Cape Verde. This is where it all started less than 2 months ago and this is the only country where I have dived so far.

 

[KenGordon]

For me (former oilfield engineer), it is an offshore platform .
I dive in Cape Verde. This is where it all started less than 2 months ago and this is the only country where I have dived so far.

Indeed, words depend on context.

are you using a wet suit or a dry suit? From there is is not so obvious to go to the Red Sea, the Caribbean might be easier. Wherever, you ought to be trying to be in charge of your own dives so you learn the bits that might otherwise pass you by.

 

[Dody]

I hate the cold even though I spent most of my life in France. So no dry suit for me and no diving in cold waters. Egypt is in north Africa so not far away from Cape Verde or Europe (7 hours flight). I am a frequent flyer anyway. In Africa, there are some other nice spots (Sao Tome, Mozambique, Maurice, Zanzibar) without mentioning South Africa but I'd rather stay away from Great white sharks.

 

[yle]

Now, it true that I have never dived just with my buddy. I have always been with an Instructor or a DM even when I was leading. But this is another proof that I am not a brainless risk taker.

But planning and executing several dives between 30 and 40 meters, I think I can do it (I got sole valuable intel in the last 2 days )... with the presence of a more experienced diver... for now.

Hold on a second...

Just my opinion, which comes from my experience as a diver and an instructor. I've had the privilege of introducing many people of all ages to the world of diving. And I would like to think most (if not all?) other instructors would agree with my advice here.

In your post here you make two statements that appear to conflict, in my opinion:

You have never dived just with your buddy, always been with an instructor or DM

You think you can plan and execute several dives between 30 and 40 meters.

Please. Do. Not.

I am concerned that you are very enthusiastic about diving, and that you were focused on "diving to 40 meters" as some milestone of accomplishment. But you are also very unsure of your skills... which is why you claim you have been very safe by always diving with an instructor or DM.

That mindset is not safe. What it tells me is that you are trying to dive beyond your skill and comfort level, but you will convince yourself it's okay because you always have an instructor or DM with you.

Please do this: plan shallow dives with just you and your buddy. How shallow? As shallow as you feel truly comfortable diving with just you and your buddy. And PLEASE be honest with yourself about your comfort level. There is no competition in scuba diving to see who can make the most deep dives. The only people who care about "deep dive count" are very inexperienced divers.

Gain experience making shallow dives, making dives that are within your comfort level. To truly be a safe diver, you need to have the confidence that you can handle problems on any dive you make... you should be confident that you can handle your own problems and any problems that your buddy might encounter. Your buddy should also develop the same confidence.

This confidence and skill is not developed by making deep dives. It is developed by spending a lot of time underwater, at shallow depths where you are comfortable. This time allows you to learn about the very subtle things that can affect your dive plan, such as currents, and allow you to learn how to handle these circumstances at shallow depths... where the margin of allowable "error" is much greater (i.e. you can learn from your mistakes without the greater risk to your life on deeper dives.)

Take your time. Develop your skills. Enjoy your diving.

 

[yle]

This one also is subject to debate. Please put yourself into my shoes. Diving might be a science ( I have actually taken the Science of Diving course) but there are many different opinions in many subjects. For example, when I took my Deep Diving course, I asked my instructor if I should not sell my Aqualung Calypso for a balanced reg in order to be comfortable breathing below 30. He told me that I would not notice the difference (so far with 5 dives below 30 and one at 40, he was right). However, he told me one thing that is even more important for me who fears my first OOA experience ( I've read that over 50% of experienced divers have had one and not only because of poor gas management): with an unbalanced regulator, getting OOA is a process. You will feel it coming as your cylinder pressure drops. With a balanced one, breathing does not depend on the depth or the cylinder pressure and OOA is sudden.

This is more of what I am concerned about. And all instructors have seen this: new divers that get very very... very... excited about diving and want to take all the classes and get all the equipment and do all the exciting things that diving has to offer.

It's very easy to get excited about diving, and it's very easy (as you see on this thread) for others to share in your excitement. But unfortunately that excitement can cause poor judgment. It can lead a new diver to take unnecessary risks, which can lead to tragic consequences.

Develop your skills. Despite the clever marketing, no kid is magically going to become a basketball star by wearing the coolest basketball shoes. Scuba gear is no different. You don't gain skill and experience by buying new gear; you should gain your skill and experience by spending a lot of time diving within your comfort level, and then buying appropriate gear as your skill and experience progress.

Be very wary of anyone that tries to get you to buy gear with the promise it will help your skills. It's good to be excited about diving, but you should direct that excitement toward spending a lot of time diving shallow with your buddy.

As for your "over 50% of experienced divers have had an OOA"... I guess I'm in the less than 50% that has not, but if you "fear" an OOA experience, you're proving my point. Dive dive dive more within your comfort level to develop your confidence.

 

[Dody]

Hold on a second...

Just my opinion, which comes from my experience as a diver and an instructor. I've had the privilege of introducing many people of all ages to the world of diving. And I would like to think most (if not all?) other instructors would agree with my advice here.

In your post here you make two statements that appear to conflict, in my opinion:

You have never dived just with your buddy, always been with an instructor or DM

You think you can plan and execute several dives between 30 and 40 meters.

Please. Do. Not.

I am concerned that you are very enthusiastic about diving, and that you were focused on "diving to 40 meters" as some milestone of accomplishment. But you are also very unsure of your skills... which is why you claim you have been very safe by always diving with an instructor or DM.

That mindset is not safe. What it tells me is that you are trying to dive beyond your skill and comfort level, but you will convince yourself it's okay because you always have an instructor or DM with you.

Please do this: plan shallow dives with just you and your buddy. How shallow? As shallow as you feel truly comfortable diving with just you and your buddy. And PLEASE be honest with yourself about your comfort level. There is no competition in scuba diving to see who can make the most deep dives. The only people who care about "deep dive count" are very inexperienced divers.

Gain experience making shallow dives, making dives that are within your comfort level. To truly be a safe diver, you need to have the confidence that you can handle problems on any dive you make... you should be confident that you can handle your own problems and any problems that your buddy might encounter. Your buddy should also develop the same confidence.

This confidence and skill is not developed by making deep dives. It is developed by spending a lot of time underwater, at shallow depths where you are comfortable. This time allows you to learn about the very subtle things that can affect your dive plan, such as currents, and allow you to learn how to handle these circumstances at shallow depths... where the margin of allowable "error" is much greater (i.e. you can learn from your mistakes without the greater risk to your life on deeper dives.)

Take your time. Develop your skills. Enjoy your diving.

To be 100 % honest, I have never felt uncomfortable underwater but my personnality makes me think about the worst case scenario all the time. And you are right, diving with a DM or instructor gives me additional peace of mind. As we say in French, I am wearing both a belt and suspenders. Geez! Very experienced divers died down there. Some with several thousands dives experience. One of my heroes, Rob Stewart died and we still don't know why except that no one was watching his 6. You can't blame me for making mistakes and at the same time for wanting extra security. If it makes me a coward, be it. But I am not sure that it means that I am not ready. When I got OW, I was supposed to be able to go to 18 m just with my buddy. I am sorry but I won't. Once again, extra security. I don't want to make Darwin Awards headlines as someone here promised me.
Today, I think about things like: can you do a CESA from 30 meters? Scientifically, it is possible if you are OOA. But what is your first stage does not work? In this case, to reach the surface, you can only rely on gas expansion in your lungs and not on the air that will be available as the gradient cylinder pressure/ water pressure will rise (DCS is another issue afterwards but better being bent that dead). Should I invest in total redundancy now? Two 1st/ 2nd stage regs. Two cylinders ( I am not side-mounted certified yet)? Should I always carry a pony?
Believe me, I spending a lot of time underwater. I am developing my skills and knowledge while learning from people like you and experiencing underwater. I still have a lot to learn. I want to learn. I want to be challenged. I want to face difficult situations. Not due to my mistakes (it might happen as outlined in this thread) but to water conditions and it comforts me to have a watchguard. Now, in 6 months, if I am still alive (99% of chances ), I will be a way better diver and I will be more ready than a fresh OW to dive autonomously with a buddy, don't you think?

 

[KenGordon]

One of my heroes, Rob Stewart died

He is a case in point, he relied on the good judgement of an instructor. You need to be able to judge for yourself what is ok or not. At the moment you are assuming because the DM is ok with a thing then it is ok. For all you know he is thinking “OMG, how can I tell him that is not ok? Oh sod it, I know I will get out ok...”

 

[Dody]

This is more of what I am concerned about. And all instructors have seen this: new divers that get very very... very... excited about diving and want to take all the classes and get all the equipment and do all the exciting things that diving has to offer.

It's very easy to get excited about diving, and it's very easy (as you see on this thread) for others to share in your excitement. But unfortunately that excitement can cause poor judgment. It can lead a new diver to take unnecessary risks, which can lead to tragic consequences.

Develop your skills. Despite the clever marketing, no kid is magically going to become a basketball star by wearing the coolest basketball shoes. Scuba gear is no different. You don't gain skill and experience by buying new gear; you should gain your skill and experience by spending a lot of time diving within your comfort level, and then buying appropriate gear as your skill and experience progress.

Be very wary of anyone that tries to get you to buy gear with the promise it will help your skills. It's good to be excited about diving, but you should direct that excitement toward spending a lot of time diving shallow with your buddy.

As for your "over 50% of experienced divers have had an OOA"... I guess I'm in the less than 50% that has not, but if you "fear" an OOA experience, you're proving my point. Dive dive dive more within your comfort level to develop your confidence.

My instructor actually talked me out of buying a balanced reg. We also discussed the Pro and Cons of full face mask because I wanted to be able to talk to my buddy underwater and I eventually did not make the purchase.
I am concerned about OOA not because I don't trust my training (watching the SPG, gas planning or equipment maintenance). I am worried about the X factor. The unknown that I haven't faced yet and that no one trained me against. Of course, it comes with experience. But not only. My objective is not to be the most competitive diver. I just want to be safe in my underwater activities.

 

[yle]

To be 100 % honest, I have never felt uncomfortable underwater but my personnality makes me think about the worst case scenario all the time.

I can relate. I saw in another post you said you're an engineer. Having a more detailed understanding of the technical aspects (i.e. the "engineering side") of diving can sometimes cause our minds to get distracted by all the "what if?' questions. In this case, it can take even longer, and requires more experience, for your skill and comfort level to catch up to your understanding of the theory.

 

[yle]

I am concerned about OOA not because I don't trust my training (watching the SPG, gas planning or equipment maintenance). I am worried about the X factor. The unknown that I haven't faced yet and that no one trained me against. Of course, it comes with experience.

Yes yes exactly! Training can only take you so far. Experience is the only way to learn about the "X factor." Take it slow. And enjoy it!

Consider making Fish ID your mission. You'll learn a lot about the critters you're visiting, spend a lot of time in the shallows, and gain a lot of that "X factor" experience in a safer environment. You'll likely find that the desire to dive deeper is replaced with a desire to buy a camera.