Finally dove with DIR buddies. What a mess!

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Roakey,
Thanks for the clarification as my understanding was merely an assumption (as I had not heard the term previously)

Detroit Diver,
Any plans to come down our way this next weekend? My wife was inquiring about when she should make you her Bailey's Irish Cream cheesecake?

Best Regards
Don
 
detroit diver once bubbled...

Wouldn't your nephews be more comfortable divers knowing that, in a current, they can place themselves in a position so as to not have to fight the current? Less concern, less gas usage, more comfort, more FUN.

Wouldn't they also decompress better having the ability to hold their position in the water column?

You don't need perfect trim and bouyancy when you dive. It just makes is a whole lot easier and a lot more fun if you do have this skill.
Yes to the above.

My brothers kids will have good trim and buoyancy control before they get their cards, bank on it. And like i said, they will develop excellent trim and buoyancy control if they continue to work at it.

Where i part ways with you is the supposition that all divers i taught before spending more time on trim, are "bad divers." The ones who have stayed active, generally are very good divers. The term "bad diver" is quite subjective IMO. To me a "good diver" stays in trim while swimming and can maintain depth control +/- a foot or so in the column, vertical or horizontal. An "excellent diver" can do all the above, keep depth control to the foot and maintain horizontal trim, swimming or not. I realize your definitions are probably different. Are the divers i'm teaching today better for the time spent on trim, yes they are. Are the students that came before them, bad divers? Not in my opinion.

I am not defending the $99 weekend class or instructors that don't spend enough time on skills, i have never agreed with that and fight it every week with the competition. But its not black and white like some of you allude. There is plenty of room between meeting agency standards and teaching all DIRF type skills. Many of us are smack-dab in the middle of the above, meeting agency standards and injecting skills such as trim into the class.

From my observation, students taught this way thrive if they are serious about the sport. The students who end up diving once or twice a year in Coz will never keep their skills up, GUE, Padi or other.
 
Please don't put words in my posts. I never said you produced BAD divers. I've never seen you teach.

I just think that, regardless of the number of times one wishes to dive, if they have the proper skills coming out of their OW class, then that is what they will dive with.

If they've been taught to do their skills on the bottom, then they will revert to that when something goes wrong. In a stressful situation, you fall back on what you learned last.

I don't think kneeling at the bottom of the Marianas Trench is a good idea!


gedunk once bubbled...

Yes to the above.

My brothers kids will have good trim and buoyancy control before they get their cards, bank on it. And like i said, they will develop excellent trim and buoyancy control if they continue to work at it.

Where i part ways with you is the supposition that all divers i taught before spending more time on trim, are "bad divers." The ones who have stayed active, generally are very good divers. The term "bad diver" is quite subjective IMO. To me a "good diver" stays in trim while swimming and can maintain depth control +/- a foot or so in the column, vertical or horizontal. An "excellent diver" can do all the above, keep depth control to the foot and maintain horizontal trim, swimming or not. I realize your definitions are probably different. Are the divers i'm teaching today better for the time spent on trim, yes they are. Are the students that came before them, bad divers? Not in my opinion.

I am not defending the $99 weekend class or instructors that don't spend enough time on skills, i have never agreed with that and fight it every week with the competition. But its not black and white like some of you allude. There is plenty of room between meeting agency standards and teaching all DIRF type skills. Many of us are smack-dab in the middle of the above, meeting agency standards and injecting skills such as trim into the class.

From my observation, students taught this way thrive if they are serious about the sport. The students who end up diving once or twice a year in Coz will never keep their skills up, GUE, Padi or other.
 
Don,

Brando and Scot are taking my tanks to Canada for a Tech class, so I won't be able to dive.

Can I take a rain check on the cheesecake, though??!!

Jack


dcostanza once bubbled...
Roakey,
Thanks for the clarification as my understanding was merely an assumption (as I had not heard the term previously)

Detroit Diver,
Any plans to come down our way this next weekend? My wife was inquiring about when she should make you her Bailey's Irish Cream cheesecake?

Best Regards
Don
 
Detroit Diver,
That's right, I forgot about you being sans tanks. Raincheck it is but it might be a month before my wife gets back in town.

Best Regards
Don
 
A month? Okay.

Especially if it's as good as the last cake she made!


dcostanza once bubbled...
Detroit Diver,
That's right, I forgot about you being sans tanks. Raincheck it is but it might be a month before my wife gets back in town.

Best Regards
Don
 
detroit diver once bubbled...
Please don't put words in my posts. I never said you produced BAD divers. I've never seen you teach.

I don't recall writing that you did. Show me where and i'll be happy to apologize for it. But your aspersions on this board are clear to me at least, so please don't pile it on like you don't diss non-GUE agencys and by association their instructors, on a regular basis. You do and your position is clear.

By the way, i invited you to come up and see me teach anytime but you choose to not respond to that. Life is full of choices isn't it dd?
 
Well, here's your post: Where i part ways with you is the supposition that all divers i taught before spending more time on trim, are "bad divers." You attributed it to me by way of supposition at least 3 times.

On a whole, I think the major agencies suck big time. I'd be the first to admit that. But I'll also say that there are instructor exceptions to that rule. My problem is, they are few and far between.

I missed your invitation, but I'm not up in your area often anyway. I was up in Charlevoix last weekend-the first time in around 5 years. So watching a class is not an option. And frankly, I'd rather be diving!

Here's an offer to you. If you think you can't teach a student proper bouyancy and trim from day 1 in the pool without touching the bottom, I'll be happy to invite you to a class that my dive buddies give (scubaguys.com). I'm sure they won't mind you sitting (floating) in. It's really neat to watch, and it doesn't take much longer that a "normal" OW class.



gedunk once bubbled...


I don't recall writing that you did. Show me where and i'll be happy to apologize for it. But your aspersions on this board are clear to me at least, so please don't pile it on like you don't diss non-GUE agencys and by association their instructors, on a regular basis. You do and your position is clear.

By the way, i invited you to come up and see me teach anytime but you choose to not respond to that. Life is full of choices isn't it dd?
 
detroit diver once bubbled...

Here's an offer to you. If you think you can't teach a student proper bouyancy and trim from day 1 in the pool without touching the bottom, I'll be happy to invite you to a class that my dive buddies give (scubaguys.com). I'm sure they won't mind you sitting (floating) in. It's really neat to watch, and it doesn't take much longer that a "normal" OW class.


Actually if I can weasle an invitation like that for myself I'll do my darndest to schedule it.
 
I was talking to Brandon when your post popped up. He said to shoot him a note at brando@scubaguys.com


MikeFerrara once bubbled...


Actually if I can weasle an invitation like that for myself I'll do my darndest to schedule it.
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/swift/

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