“Duty of Care” when taking others on personal vessel, to dive

[2airishuman]

I do go out on shore dives with friends, family, and sometimes people I don't know especially well. I've had people diving from my boats but only family at this point. I don't take people's money.

I think the broader question is what sort of a host, diver, and captain do you want to be for your friends (etc).

I like to be the kind of host/diver/captain that thinks of contingencies and prepares for them, by having things like first aid kits and oxygen available, and by planning dives and boat trips conservatively.

 

[tridacna]

Doesn't it totally suck that a guy with a boat.....like me, can't just go diving with his trusted buddies without worrying about who is going to sue who?

I do it. I don't charge anything. My friends just throw in on fuel costs and always help with clean-up....etc.

It really sucks that liability would ever be a concern.

PS..... Lawyers are welcome on my boat as long as they have at least 60-70 lbs of lead to make sure they can easily descend

Don’t blame the lawyers. Blame the law.

 

[Eric802]

PS..... Lawyers are welcome on my boat as long as they have at least 60-70 lbs of lead to make sure they can easily descend

 

[agilis]

Lawyers are free to file lawsuits in almost any situation where liability is an issue, especially if the accused offender has insurance or deep pockets. The judicial system is disinclined to prevent lawsuits, allowing them to proceed except in rare instances. If someone is injured on a private boat (or automobile), even if they are a non-paying guest, there is nothing to prevent them from suing the owner, who must bear the costs of litigation unless they are well insured.

 

[JMarc]

Don’t blame the lawyers. Blame the law.

People usually want the full protection offered by the law, but none of the liabilities.

 

[KeelsonGraham]

Choose your dive partners carefully.​

 

[Belzelbub]

Am I legally required to carry O2? (Full disclaimer: I already carry two completely separate emergency O2 kits for redundancy in emergencies, even if I am not diving or taking divers out.)

No, you aren't legally required to carry O2. In fact, unless you have an 02 Provider cert, you may have some difficulty getting 100% O2 fills. Oxygen is classified as a drug.

Am I legally required to administer first aid in the event of a minor injury? What if my friend refused?

No. Not as a lay person. A professionally trained Dr. or first responder may have a duty to help, but even then, the victim may refuse aid. Some of this is covered in a First Aid/EFR course. Which I would recommend taking anyway. One of the things that was made pretty clear in this course is that you need to get permission from the victim to help. One caveat is if the victim is unconscious. In that case, consent is presumed.

There are some that have divers on their private boat sign a waiver. That probably doesn't hurt too much, but not ironclad either.

You are the captain of the boat. A captain has a number of obligations and responsibilities, which are the same also if passengers are not paying.
Did not you learn about captain's responsibilities when you did follow the course for getting your captain's license?

A Captain's license is required for a for-hire vessel. A Captain's license is generally not required for a private vessel. There are rules around contribution amounts to keep the trip private vs. charter. Authorities in some areas have been cracking down on illegal charters. A rule of thumb is that the passengers can contribute to a share of the expenses. The owner can post on social media to take out additional divers with an expectation of a share of fuel, ice, etc. costs. Posting a set amount as a fee is where it gets into trouble.

And as far as courses go for a private vessel. It depends. I technically do not need to have taken any course or need any license to operate my boat. I did take a course, but it isn't required for me because I've been grandfathered in. Law was passed in FL requiring education, but everyone born before that date is exempt. Even then, it's not a license. It's an education requirement.

Also your authority is truly absolute: everyone on board must simply follow your orders. No exception...

Agreed with this 100%.

 

[Belzelbub]

Help me out here. I have been unable to find any place in the CFRs where there is a requirement for a first aid kit for recreational vessels, or for uninspected commercial vessels other than fishing vessels.

I carry one anyway. I even carry one on my little 12' aluminum boat.

46 CFR § 184.710 - First-aid kits.

www.law.cornell.edu

It refers in that text to a Vessel. Not sure how that is defined, so there is likely some minimum length associated.

 

[NW Dive Dawg]

When talking about "Duty of Care"...I think it might important to distinguish the difference between "legal" duty of care and "moral" duty of care.

Not much I can really do about eliminating the legal duty of care other than to just go out by myself and dive alone. Even then, if I got hurt or whacked, some greedy legal beagle would find some reason that I should sue myself for everything possible and then give him 40%. I mean where does it end? When you have friends over to your house do you have them sign liability waivers and issue helmets in case your chandelier falls on their head or they trip over their own shadows and take a fall.

The "moral" duty of care, however, is actually something I do have control over. So I just do my best.

• I keep a well maintained boat with way MORE than the required CG Safety Gear.
• I have multiple redundant navigation, signaling, communications and emergency equip onboard.
• I do thorough briefings on both dive op's and boat op's and emergency procedures.
• I am current on my first aid and CPR certs...including an onboard AED.
• I keep a full 80CF of emergency O2 onboard with multiple delivery options for both conscious and unconscious divers.
• I have the ability to admin 100% O2 to a long hose 2nd stage at 15ft for IWR if I feel that's the best option.
• I choose carefully who I allow to dive from my boat...

Basically, there is no possibility of eliminating all risk.......so I just do my best to mitigate it.

 

[Belzelbub]

When you have friends over to your house do you have them sign liability waivers and issue helmets in case your chandelier falls on their head or they trip over their own shadows and take a fall.

Yeah. Good point. That's where insurance comes in. Homeowners insurance in this case, but my boat policy comes into play on the boat. Some things are avoidable others may be just accidents. Negligence will definitely up the liability piece. Having a well maintained boat with at least the minimum required equipment on board will work in your favor.

There is a small list of people that I'll take diving from my boat. These are people that I've known for a very long time, and in some case all their lives (my kids). They know how to act on boats and that's why they are invited back. Also, knowing them, I know they aren't looking to file a frivolous claim.

Despite that, one of them did actually get injured during a diving trip on my boat. Technically just after the trip, and not on the boat, but on the dock at the ramp. He was helping with the lines while I went to get the truck. He was barefoot and managed to kick one of the cleats on the dock. Separated a couple of his toes and split the skin between his toes. His wife was also on the ride with us, so I let her know. She went to her car to grab her medical bag (Dr.). Later that day, she gave him a few stitches between his toes. I think she kind of enjoyed it. She did give him novocaine, but I'm sure she called him a dumbass with each stitch she put in.