Drowning at Windy Point 10-13-2007

[Teknadv3x]

First off I would like to send my condolences and to let his family know they are in my prayers during these very hard times.

My Hats off to the rescue peeps.... Great job, you did what you were suppose to.

The only thing we can do now is learn from what happened.
When in a situation that the dragon is breathing down your neck , you MUST and I say again you MUST remain calm and sort out the situation.

This incident is a prime example showing Fear & Stress will kill you quicker than drowning.



Dave

 

[texdiveguy]

Such could be said about *every* accident and thus we would never discuss accidents or learn from them.

Reef , there are plenty of well documented SCUBA related dive accidents and follow-up investigations available in print to learn from. I am a strong advocate of dive safety and prescribe to reading as many of the sources available.....but this 'particular' SB 'thread' accident analysis does nothing positive and the reader/s learn nothing.

 

[UnderSeaBumbleBee]

Reef , there are plenty of well documented SCUBA related dive accidents and follow-up investigations available in print to learn from. I am a strong advocate of dive safety and prescribe to reading as many of the sources available.....but this 'particular' SB forum accident analysis does nothing positive and the reader/s learn nothing.

I have to disagree with you because I personally learned a few things from the accident forum last year that I am convinced beyond a doubt saved my life on one particular dive. You may have nothing to learn, but many of us do.

 

[texdiveguy]

You may have nothing to learn, but many of us do.

Now were did I say that....please re read my post.........

 

[UnderSeaBumbleBee]

but this 'particular' SB forum accident analysis does nothing positive and the reader/s learn nothing.

Yeah I read your post again. This particular forum, IE the accident analysis forum--see quote above-- does nothing positive and the readers learn nothing. Did you not mean what you said?

 

[texdiveguy]

Yeah I read your post again. This particular forum, IE the accident analysis forum--see quote above-- does nothing positive and the readers learn nothing. Did you not mean what you said?

You simply interpreted it wrong...I probably should have used the word thread as opposed to forum....I ment THIS particular incident. Hope that clears that up.

PS...'please' take time to fill in your SB bio information, nice to know a bit about fellow forum members.

 

[OWSI176288]

This incident is a prime example showing Fear & Stress will kill you quicker than drowning.

How so????? How is this a "prime example" showing fear & stress will kill you quicker than drowning?!? It is still unclear from the limited facts and info so far, that this unfortunate incident wasn't due to a medical condition (heart attack, stroke, etc.), diver error, panic, etc. Assuming that fear and stress was the root cause is making a pretty big assumption right now.

I am not disagreeing that fear and stress can lead to panic, which can cause a diver to be injured or worse. I just do not see how it applies to this situation.

 

[Teknadv3x]

How so????? How is this a "prime example" showing fear & stress will kill you quicker than drowning?!? It is still unclear from the limited facts and info so far, that this unfortunate incident wasn't due to a medical condition (heart attack, stroke, etc.), diver error, panic, etc. Assuming that fear and stress was the root cause is making a pretty big assumption right now.

I am not disagreeing that fear and stress can lead to panic, which can cause a diver to be injured or worse. I just do not see how it applies to this situation.

After reading the following:

you said on the Scubatoys site that the instructor had told him he could not dive with the AOW class because the instructor did not feel he was ready and that he was diving on his own is this correct? I happened to be at the lake and overheard your group talking with a Sheriff's deputy and heard that the instructor say he was going to take the distressed diver to the surface because he was having problems. The instructor said he turned to tell 2 other divers to continue their dive and then turned back to find the distressed diver missing. I am not sure I understand. Was he diving on his own and then ran into the group and then became separated?.......................

I stand my ground on what I feel happened. 52 year old male, new diver stressed and then panicked, flight or fight kicked in and his heart gave out.

 

[texdiveguy]

......... 52 year old male...........,

....that hits close to home.

 

[OWSI176288]

After reading the following:
I stand my ground on what I feel happened. 52 year old male, new diver stressed and then panicked, flight or fight kicked in and his heart gave out.

You're certainly entitled to have an option. But that's all it is, an option (of many possible ones).

You're making the assumption base on very little information that stress and panic lead to a heart attack. You quoted “I happened to be at the lake and overheard your group talking with a Sheriff's deputy and heard that the instructor say he was going to take the distressed diver to the surface because he was having problems. The instructor said he turned to tell 2 other divers to continue their dive and then turned back to find the distressed diver missing.” One could argue that it’s just as feasible that the heart attack came first and that's why he was “distressed.” As the same person also is quoted as saying "He had fully functioning gear, 1000 psi. He was still grasping his light and he still had his mask and fins on which means whatever happened to him happened quick...no signs of panic or struggle."
In addition, most divers who panic (and fight or flight instinct kicks in) bolt to the surface, and if injured, suffer a lung over expansion injury or embolism. There is no indication that that's what happened.

All that is known is that at some point he became separated and was alone. Without more info from someone who was actually with him the whole time, the real root cause may never be known. Which in and of its self might be a lesson to be learned.