Documentary on solo diving

[Nemrod]

Oh well, it all comes out in the wash. N

 

[vshearer]

Here we go again.

 

[Darnold9999]

So if I understand the arguement, diving is an extremely dangerous activity that requires a special unique level of skill that only the elite few are capable of acquiring. I assume you include yourself [24940] in this very special category.

I'm sorry but my BS meter just pegged. Pretty elitist attitude. While the consequenses of an accident are quite severe the activity is safer than a large number of other things you can do and the level of skill required to go out and have a look around and come back is pretty minimal. To do it solo requires not much more than paying attention. To go to 100 feet and NOT return even "up here" is extremely unusual and requires a significant run of bad luck or extreme stupidity.

Basic recreational diving - go out and have a look around takes a minimal level of skill and a minimal amount of training.

Not that you should dive without training but the whole diving is an "extremely dangerous" sport is tiresome. Like many things in life if you do stupid things it will kill you, but pay attention and dive within your abilities and training and the likelyhood of killing yourself is virtually nil.

 

[DaleC]

I was only half joking before (as anyone who collects stupid nereas sayings can't be that bad) but you really are bitter. Youch! Please, try to find your happy place.

If you think the overall skills/attitude/standards of divers is positive, perhaps you might consider raising your standards.

I guess that's it. I don't find it necessary to judge the abilities of the rest of the diving community.. only my own (and my buddies). I also don't get bent over the way people drive, the trustworthiness of politicians, the trouble with kids these days and all the other things I can't do anything about. I could bust both my hands trying to slap sense into them all but nobody elected me into that position. Maybe I live in ignorant bliss but I'm happy and I enjoy diving and the people I meet while diving

No, it's not really the same. With buddy diving you have more options.

I say, no you don't.
Having opted into the buddy system instead of self sufficiency one is only half as prepared when the s_it hits it and you can't find your buddy. Only a self sufficient diver has more options in the usual buddy situation.

Now, saying well trained, properly supplied, cohesive diving teams are safer is correct but in the "real" world what are the odds of happening upon those buddies? Yes, those divers do exist (I'd like to find one that wants to dive my profiles) but on this board (for example) they are also often the same posters that say they would never dive with someone they didn't know.

Let me present a recent dive profile that I did and see if any divers who have invested a lot of time and practice into team diving would want to join me as a buddy:

FW lake, 50 degrees F, barren bottom with 1ft. of undisturbed silt - 0 vis when disturbed, Mission: observing and collecting FW sculpins (basically hovering and staring under rocks and logs for drab, 3" fish). 90 minutes at a maximum 40' with an average of 25'.

Any takers?

The concept of buddy diving is solid, it's application is not. Pointing to a couple of idiots who are, in effect, solo diving with a buddy and using that as a basis for judgment of the buddy system is just ignorant.

But pointing at a couple of idiots soloing and using that as a basis for judgment of soloing isn't?

No matter what the hermaphrodites say, you can't have it both ways

Again, I question why you are posting in this sub forum. You obviously hold a negative view of soloing. Just like DIR it's an opt in thing. We opt in here. If you don't.. don't. What do you think the response would be if I posted into the cave divers sub forum (something I think is far more inherently dangerous than soloing) and began telling them how I thought cave diving was dangerous and shouldn't be promoted and the state of cave divers was piss poor etc... etc... warm and fuzzies???
Even though I have no desire to cave dive and think it's extremely dangerous I still respect their right to pursue it.

To the OP: Perhaps a good subject for a documentary would be the controversy that surrounds this subject within the diving community... I used to solo climb extensively and this same debate also raged in that sport as well; even though most of the top climbers soloed.

 

[Dive-aholic]

I am going to be starting a small documentary on solo diving.

I am asking for any person that is an expert on this sport to be an adviser for me.

I really think that this sport needs to be shown how good the guys are that do this kind of diving and why they dive solo.
I want to show the world the true essence of solo diving in all of its aspects.

I thank you and wait for your advise..!

Just go out to some of the caves not too far from you. You should not only find divers who have solo'd, but also divers who are about to solo. Just make sure you're not at a state park.

From my experience, solo divers as a whole are less dialed in than team divers.

You're experiences haven't been all that great then. My typical mindset whether I'm diving with a buddy or solo is the same - I'm very dialed in to everything, myself, anyone around me, the environment around me. When I'm solo I can be even more dialed in because I have one less thing to pay attention to. When I'm solo, I also bring added redundancy (on top of what I normally have). But then again, where I solo dictates that...

 

[Doc Harry]

hounddog, good luck!

From my experience, solo divers as a whole are less dialed in than team divers. It doesn't take any more special skill or knowledge to dive solo than it does to drive 100mph.... til things go sideways. Many of the guys I've known to solo were just lucky, as their skills and experience were less than ideal.

24940, welcome to Solo Diver's forum!

Most "team divers" whom I've seen are not dialed in at diving, let alone team diving. Yeah, it takes a lot of "skill" and "situational awareness" to be a same-ocean team diver!

I've got a ball cap for you, it's got a large "L" on the front, and it doesn't stand for "Laverne."

Send $59.95 for shipping and handling and get it to you right away. I can also send "L" ball caps to your team members for an additional $9.95 each.

 

[24940]

So if I understand the arguement, diving is an extremely dangerous activity that requires a special unique level of skill that only the elite few are capable of acquiring. I assume you include yourself [24940] in this very special category.

Clearly, you don't understand anything I wrote. Since there seems to be a lack of comprehension on your part, perhaps you could quote what I wrote, which led you to believe I stated diving is extremely dangerous, requires a "special unique" level of skill or that only an elite few are capable of attaining the skills required for safe diving.

hounddog, good luck!



24940, welcome to Solo Diver's forum!

Most "team divers" whom I've seen are not dialed in at diving, let alone team diving. Yeah, it takes a lot of "skill" and "situational awareness" to be a same-ocean team diver!

Your statement makes as much sense as someone saying "all solo divers I've seen maintained excellent buddy contact.". "same ocean team diver" is an oxymoron in my book and is as far removed from the definition of team as would be the distinction between a newly certified OW diver doing a solo dive and the type of diver I know Rob to be.


How do you all feel about these statements:

A diver with 10 logged dives is fine to solo in 45 degree water and 6' vis..

A diver with 50 dives is fine to solo in 35 degree water, 3' vis at depths of 130' on an AL80, without redundant gas.

A diver should solo if they can't keep track of their buddy.

Divers in poor physical condition are fine to solo rough coastal waters of Oregon.

Diving is perfectly safe, requires no skill and absolutely anyone can do it safely.

Every diver I have seen has been perfectly safe.

You're experiences haven't been all that great then.

Rob, my experiences have been great. What I observe..... not so much.

My typical mindset whether I'm diving with a buddy or solo is the same - I'm very dialed in to everything, myself, anyone around me, the environment around me. When I'm solo I can be even more dialed in because I have one less thing to pay attention to. When I'm solo, I also bring added redundancy (on top of what I normally have). But then again, where I solo dictates that...

I guess that makes you even more elitist than me. While I don't cave, I believe we are on the same page here.

Oh well, it all comes out in the wash. N

Your post was far more entertaining before you edited it.

 

[24940]

OK, now that I have a minute...

I was only half joking before (as anyone who collects stupid nereas sayings can't be that bad) but you really are bitter. Youch! Please, try to find your happy place.

Thanks for your concern, but this IS my happy place.

I guess that's it. I don't find it necessary to judge the abilities of the rest of the diving community.. only my own (and my buddies). I also don't get bent over the way people drive, the trustworthiness of politicians, the trouble with kids these days and all the other things I can't do anything about. I could bust both my hands trying to slap sense into them all but nobody elected me into that position. Maybe I live in ignorant bliss but I'm happy and I enjoy diving and the people I meet while diving

If I see a guy run a red light and say "hey, that guy ran a red light", it's not a judgment, it's an observation. I may even go so far as to say "Man, that's not very safe. That guy was very lucky not to have caused an accident". I think this parallels my statements regarding many of the solo dives I have witnessed first hand and don't believe it is judgmental. As an instructor, I have developed the habit of assessing risk, that's part of the job and it doesn't end with assessing my risk.

I don't get twisted over things, especially those things that have no direct impact on me. Trust me on this.

I say, no you don't.
Having opted into the buddy system instead of self sufficiency one is only half as prepared when the s_it hits it and you can't find your buddy. Only a self sufficient diver has more options in the usual buddy situation.

OOA scenario: what options are available to a cohesive team (not talking same ocean diver here.) vs a solo diver without a redundant gas supply.

I fully agree that a competent solo diver would have an edge in a team, as long as they can dive as a team.

Now, saying well trained, properly supplied, cohesive diving teams are safer is correct but in the "real" world what are the odds of happening upon those buddies?

That's all I'm saying. Just because there are not many people diving in this way doesn't mean it's not a good idea.

Let me present a recent dive profile that I did and see if any divers who have invested a lot of time and practice into team diving would want to join me as a buddy:

FW lake, 50 degrees F, barren bottom with 1ft. of undisturbed silt - 0 vis when disturbed, Mission: observing and collecting FW sculpins (basically hovering and staring under rocks and logs for drab, 3" fish). 90 minutes at a maximum 40' with an average of 25'.

Any takers?

Hell yes.
Wanna do one of mine? 35 degrees, 131' max depth, :44 BT to free a snagged mooring cable using a come along( they don't get easier to operate at depth)0" vis during the working portion of the dive and probably 4'-8' otherwise. Video quality sucks as I have the light head in the same hand I'm using to equalize and adjust buoyancy with.

But pointing at a couple of idiots soloing and using that as a basis for judgment of soloing isn't?

No matter what the hermaphrodites say, you can't have it both ways

I have made no judgment on soloing, I have made an observation about divers soloing who are not doing so in a safe manner.

What do you think the response would be if I posted into the cave divers sub forum (something I think is far more inherently dangerous than soloing) and began telling them how I thought cave diving was dangerous and shouldn't be promoted and the state of cave divers was piss poor etc... etc... warm and fuzzies???

If yu speak in general terms that condemn the entire activity, you'ld be rightfully thrashed, I suspect. If you make the observation people shouldn't be cave diving without proper preperation, gear and experience, I suspect there wouldn't be much disagreement, assuming they didn't twist your words and assign meaning wherenone existed.

Let me be as clear as possible:

I am a diver. There is an element of risk involved with diving, which I believe can be reduced with the proper mindset, proper gear and procedures. I feel the level of risk I expose myself to can be reduced in numerous ways. I feel many divers are oblivious to these risks and are alive because they have not encountered a situation where they were tested. Gear is pretty reliable and most divers are not diving in extreme conditions.

I am a solo diver. I do what I can to reduce risk, because I feel there are less options for resolving issues without a team. Free ascents are one of the tools I have and have performed free ascents (CESA) from depths as deep as 115'. I know I can get to the surface if I have to, but I also carry redundant gas if diving over 80' and tickling the NDLs. I don't feel this makes me elite or special, just prepared. If you choose to solo at depths you have never performed a free ascent from, I feel you are less prepared than you should be to perform safely.

There are risks associated with each type of diving and people who ignore those risks in each. I condemn neither activity and fully participate in each.

Again, I do take issue with promoting an activity which anyone can pursue without a clue of what risks are involved abd how to mitigate those risks.

OK, guys... I'm going back to work... If you want to take issue with anything I say, I'm good with that, but please try comprehending the words before responding to them. It's like you are quoting my posts and replying to someone else's.

 

[nereas]

Robert Van Maier already did a book on it, called:

SOLO DIVING.

 

[Dive-aholic]

Rob, my experiences have been great. What I observe..... not so much.

Point taken. I should have said what you observe. Before I moved to Florida I observed some of the same types of practices as you have...

Robert Van Maier already did a book on it, called:

SOLO DIVING.

Not a very good book. And definitely not the way to learn solo diving.