Do you actually see people diving with pony bottles?

[MXGratefulDiver]

Not really upset my any one person. It just seems a common comment that if you are an air hog you are not a good diver.

It's not always true, but most times it's the case that people who go through their air quickly do not have very good technique. The fact is that the most you exert yourself, the more air you're going to go through. This is as true above the surface as below ... except that in the former case you have an inexhaustible supply so nobody worries about it.

When I was a fairly new diver my buddies would tease me that they could see the sides of my tank move when I breathed. But that then I wasn't a very good diver. My trim was awful, I tended to use my arms a lot, and was constantly kicking to stay off the bottom. As my technique improved I learned how to relax, stopped using my arms, got in better trim, learned more efficient propulsion techniques, and most importantly, slowed down. All of those things improved my air consumption, despite the fact that I was still the same overweight old man that I had been back when I was hooving through my air at twice the rate as my dive buddies..

Yes, there are some people ... particularly large people ... who just need more air. And it's not a contest ... use what you need to use. But don't use your physique as an excuse to not improve ... you'd be amazed how far a large person can go on an AL80 if they've got good technique ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Most of the "air hogs" I have witnessed were large guys. They were not ballerinas, for sure.

Most ... but it's not always the case. My ex-wife was half my size, and yet her consumption rate was higher than mine. She was a good diver, but she was also someone who could get excited underwater. I could always tell when she spotted something really cool just by watching her exhaust bubbles ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[MXGratefulDiver]

Agreed. Many of the divers who once had pony bottles here have moved on to twinsets, back mounted or side mounted. We still see ponies a bit, but not like in the early to mid-2000's, in my estimation.

I've kind've gone the other direction. Went from single tank to backmount doubles around 2004. Got into sidemount in 2009. Now for most of my diving I use a single backmount cylinder ... and when solo diving (about half my dives) I bring along an AL40. Yesterday's dive, for example ... did 68 minutes to a max depth of 122 feet on a single 130, slinging a pony. Came back with plenty of air in reserve (about 800 psi). Most dives of that profile I'd use sidemount, but the beach access was a bit of a pain, so I decided it was easier to just do it all in one trip ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

 

[mi000ke]

I believe it is indeed an equipment issue. There are some configurations where there is no straightforward way to be absolutely sure that the reg in your mouth is the primary, particularly when you're at depth where the light is poor, you're wearing gloves, and you're perhaps a little narced. Which, after all, is the sort of dive that you might want to bring a pony along for). Colors and textures aren't reliable indicators. If your primary and pony are back mounted and the hoses both come off the top then how are you supposed to tell?

OK, I guess. I was assuming a slung pony, not back mount. I'm not that familiar with back mount configurations. I sling my pony and clip the pony reg to my left shoulder, so I know exactly where it is. And being clipped I know that it is not my main reg, which is hopefully in my mouth, or my safe second which is clipped to my right waist. I would think it might make sense to come up with a back-mount equipment configuration that would mitigate hose/reg confusion. I'm sure there must be some safe way to back mount a pony. But I'll be slinging mine.

 

[Diving Dubai]

If your primary and pony are back mounted and the hoses both come off the top then how are you supposed to tell?

Easy. You sling your cylinders and eliminate the confusion of back mounted ponies, which are more hassle than they are worth

 

[Diving Dubai]

Yes, there are some people ... particularly large people ... who just need more air. And it's not a contest ... use what you need to use. But don't use your physique as an excuse to not improve ... you'd be amazed how far a large person can go on an AL80 if they've got good technique ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Absolutely!!

I'm a 50 yr old smoker, yet can hold my own against a 20 yr old on a Al 80. My wife is a similar age (non smoker) but carries more bioprene that she would like, yet she can pish all over a 20 something Indonesian dive guide when it comes to air consumption

Sure, people have different needs, however too many people make excuses. Good weighting and trim together with conservative movements underwater and of course being relaxed, go a long way to improving gas consumption

 

[markmud]

Most ... but it's not always the case. My ex-wife was half my size, and yet her consumption rate was higher than mine. She was a good diver, but she was also someone who could get excited underwater. I could always tell when she spotted something really cool just by watching her exhaust bubbles ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

Hi Bob,

As usual I enjoyed reading your posts.

As you mentioned...most...are large guys. However, there always anomalies when discussing a generalization.

I solved my gas consumption by trim, technique, and proper weighting. Learning to breath rhythmically also helped.

While breathing from the huge atmospheric sky tank, I never realized how much air I cycle through until I started diving.

thanks,
markm

 

[The Chairman]

sling my pony and clip the pony reg to my left shoulder, so I know exactly where it is.

This makes no sense? Why not just clip the pony's reg to itself??? That way, if you pass it off, the reg goes right along with it with no hassle. Whereas I've never had to use a pony, I've had people on the dive need the air twice.

 

[Diving Dubai]

This makes no sense? Why not just clip the pony's reg to itself??? That way, if you pass it off, the reg goes right along with it with no hassle. Whereas I've never had to use a pony, I've had people on the dive need the air twice.

Agree...

In my mind, Ponies are the same as Deco or stages. Dress the reg and hose with a bungee down the cylinder. If you need it, pull teh reg, stick it in your mouth and job done. If someone else needs it, do the same. Simple. If you dont' use it, simply unclip the cylinder at the end of the dive without any additional faffing

Why over complicate things with additional clips etc

Imagine the length of thread and chaos if SBers were asked to design the wheel...

 

[markmud]

2Airishuman wrote:
I think there are three camps at ScubaBoard:
1. People who can't figure out why any skilled diver would want to use a pony and wonder what all the fuss is about
2. People like @The Chairman, @CuzzA, and a few others who, as you describe, use a pony cylinder on substantially all dives within recreational limits
3. People who use a pony cylinder for select dives where a twinset is not workable and where factors like depth, visibility, temperature, surface conditions, etc., etc., make redundant air a wise choice.

Hi 2air,
This theme has slowly morphed and I like your take the best. I am definitely in the bullet point #2 crowd.

There is also more recognition that a large number of accidents involve scenarios that include both buddy separation and an OOA emergency.

I think your point is right on and is worth iterating. Vacation tropical divers really don't follow strict buddy diving protocols. To be a useful buddy you need to be close.

Last summer, my wife and I were swimming at our club's pool. We did this about twice per week. We were swimming laps. I decided to swim u/w while holding my breath. I had been riding bikes up to 20 miles per trip, running a little bit, and doing other exercises. I am definitely not an athlete.

I could not believe it. I could not swim the length of the pool u/w while holding my breath!! It took several days before I could swim the length of the pool u/w.

Try swimming u/w with SCUBA gear while holding your breath and searching for your buddy!

No thanks, I'll take my small pony for that situation.

markm