Diving incident at Eagles Nest Sink

[oya]

I believe Wayne's comment is slightly inaccurate in that the vast majority of all rebreather fatalities are associated with FAILURES BY HUMAN OPERATORS better categorized as:

I think what you're getting into here is a higher level of precision than the average diver (much less non-diver) is prepared to fully appreciate the nuance of or speak fluently on.

Before all the facts are presented and the incident can be really teased apart by thorough (or, as-thorough-as-possible) accident analysis I would say it's important that as many people from within the dive community understand and can present as simple a message as possible. I'd agree with Wayne's easy to digest, "the majority of all rebreather fatalities are diver error," for now.

This is not to say that all rebreather divers who die are terrible screw-ups, nor that in this, most recent tragedy, that the divers we lost were terrible divers. By what little I know they were both accomplished, experienced, and capable. So, perhaps the easy lead-in to the more complex message that you raise is that even the best among us are capable of tragic mistakes.

 

[The Chairman]

Thanks to @kensuf for a detailed report. We've been advised to "not speculate", and my point is that without pertinent information that is all we can do. Only the facts can appreciably reduce gossip. Today on Good Morning America, they specified that they were found in "The Pit". I've also learned from multiple sources that they were found at 260 and 290, not that far apart and that they were on JJ rebreathers. No confirmation or denial on that last bit of information from the agencies and my sources gave me permission to publish this.

 

[PfcAJ]

Thanks to @kensuf for a detailed report. We've been advised to "not speculate", and my point is that without pertinent information that is all we can do. Only the facts can appreciably reduce gossip. Today on Good Morning America, they specified that they were found in "The Pit". I've also learned from multiple sources that they were found at 260 and 290, not that far apart and that they were on JJ rebreathers. No confirmation or denial on that last bit of information from the agencies and my sources gave me permission to publish this.

220ft.

More gear was found at 260 and 290.

 

[The Chairman]

220ft.

More gear was found at 260 and 290.

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Ron Lee]

What is 220 feet? Both bodies found at that depth?

 

[rjack321]

If you were the guy who was supposed to meet them at 3PM would you assume they were "at the bottom" and already dead when they didn't show up on time? More importantly, should the guy who waited have made that assumption? Maybe the layout of the cave is such that failure to return guaranteed that they had to be at a depth that made successful rescue an impossibility, but the 3rd diver would have to know that or where the divers were eventually found is irrelevant to what he should have done.

Its incredibly naïve to assume that the 3rd diver could have summoned "help" which had any plausible chance of helping these guys. Its just not possible (unless that help is already on-site and basically ready to dive). Yes there have been a few successful cave diving "rescues" by someone who was minutes away and could splash at almost a moments notice. And in at least one of those cases the victim was breathing out of an air pocket less than a 100 or so feet inside the cave in less than 60ft of water.

As @Dsix36 said, people have been delayed in the past by several hours and survived (with their own resources). Chastising their safety diver for not getting out of his gear, driving 20 or 30 minutes down the (dirt) road until he got cell service and calling for the mythical rescue team sooner is a mistake. It suggests to lay readers of this thread in the media or family or whatever that the safety diver bears some responsibility for their deaths through the timing of his actions which is just completely untrue.

 

[mdb]

Cave country has a very experienced group of search, rescue, recovery divers.

Location has a lot to do with timely response.

Recovery does offer some relief to the families.

There are always lessons to be learned from such tragic events.

Hope this thread stays on track and we can learn more to help educate other divers.

Condolences to the families and friends of the lost divers.

 

[Jax]

Its incredibly naïve to assume that the 3rd diver could have summoned "help" which had any plausible chance of helping these guys. Its just not possible (unless that help is already on-site and basically ready to dive). Yes there have been a few successful cave diving "rescues" by someone who was minutes away and could splash at almost a moments notice. And in at least one of those cases the victim was breathing out of an air pocket less than a 100 or so feet inside the cave in less than 60ft of water.

As @Dsix36 said, people have been delayed in the past by several hours and survived (with their own resources). Chastising their safety diver for not getting out of his gear, driving 20 or 30 minutes down the (dirt) road until he got cell service and calling for the mythical rescue team sooner is a mistake. It suggests to lay readers of this thread in the media or family or whatever that the safety diver bears some responsibility for their deaths through the timing of his actions which is just completely untrue.

Absolutely agree the safety diver should not be chastised, admonished, or any way held responsible. He did what he did for what were, to him, very good reasons at the time.

However, the question of when to call for help is a very prudent one to discuss. Clear communications, definite line (time), and making it okay for someone to call a false alarm is important.

 

[BDSC]

We've been advised to "not speculate", and my point is that without pertinent information that is all we can do.

Pete, I was just wondering when you say this, exactly who advised you/us to not speculate? Law Enforcement, Recovery Team, Friends & Family, etc. A lot of speculation goes on in this forum as a means to possibly learn from.

 

[Storker]

Chastising their safety diver for not getting out of his gear, driving 20 or 30 minutes down the (dirt) road until he got cell service and calling for the mythical rescue team sooner is a mistake.

I think you may be overreacting ever so slightly when you talk about "blaming" and "chastising". You may have missed:

At least that's how I'm used to doing it. It may be different where you dive, so I can only say how it's done here.

Now that I've made that minor point, I won't post again in this thread.