Diving Doubles?

[CuriousRambler]

So what's the major difference between Halcyon's Pioneer and Eclipse rigs? There's a pretty impressive price difference, is there anything worth the extra hundred bucks? Either way I'll go with the Pioneer, but I'm curious what's worth the extra cash.

Would any of you suggest against getting a Halcyon rig? I'm kind of leaning that way because that's what a couple friends dive, so that's what I have the most input on. If there's any reason to avoid them, I figure you're the group to ask.

 

[PerroneFord]

Two big differences.

The wings are contructed differently. On the pioneer there is one layer of material. Essentially, the material of the wing is sewn together airtight and RF welded at the seams. In the eclipse wing, there is an internal bladder that holds the air, and an outer fabric that provides punture and abrasion resistance. Much like a bicycle tire.

The other main difference is that the Eclipse comes with a single tank adapter. You want this. Trust me. It allows your wing and backplate to go on like it does in doubles, instead of being held on by just the cambands.

I bought the Pioneer 27. It's fine for my use, but I still got an single tank Adapter. It makes moving my backplate over to my doubles a breeze. And yes the difference between the Pioneer and the Eclipse is EASILY worth $100.

I would not have any qualms recommending the Halcyon system with ONE caveat. Be SURE if you order it, to get the PLASTIC inflator. Trust me on this. The only drawback is that they tend to be more expensive that some other good options.

So what's the major difference between Halcyon's Pioneer and Eclipse rigs? There's a pretty impressive price difference, is there anything worth the extra hundred bucks? Either way I'll go with the Pioneer, but I'm curious what's worth the extra cash.

Would any of you suggest against getting a Halcyon rig? I'm kind of leaning that way because that's what a couple friends dive, so that's what I have the most input on. If there's any reason to avoid them, I figure you're the group to ask.

 

[CuriousRambler]

So the stainless inflator they talk so much good about, actually isn't any good? How much is an STA alone? The one on fifthd.com is $99 for just the STA, if that's the case then I'll definitely go with the Eclipse. From what you said though, the only differences are the wing in the two rigs, so later on I could buy a 27# Pioneer to save some money over another Eclipse, and it would all go together? I think I'm liking BP/W's more and more...

 

[PerroneFord]

So the stainless inflator they talk so much good about, actually isn't any good? How much is an STA alone? The one on fifthd.com is $99 for just the STA, if that's the case then I'll definitely go with the Eclipse. From what you said though, the only differences are the wing in the two rigs, so later on I could buy a 27# Pioneer to save some money over another Eclipse, and it would all go together? I think I'm liking BP/W's more and more...

You're starting to get the idea.

Is the stainless inflator any good? Well I *LOVE* mine. But they need to be maintained, and in saltwater they get surface rust. I bent the ear of Halcyon's N.American Sales Rep yesterday over this. They've discontinued the stainless inflators and gone to the generic plastic ones. They'll require far less maintenance, and be more reliable. Again, mine has never failed me.

Most of the STA's are about $80-120.

Why would you buy a Pioneer wing? The eclipse would be your single tank wing, then you could get a double tank wing. And you could buy one from anyone. I bought a Halcyon Pioneer 27 setup. I use it with a Dive Rite classic 59# doubles wing, I've used it with an Oxycheq 45# wing, and just ordered a Deep Sea Supply 45# wing. They change out with 2 wingnuts. No other modification required. Zero. This is only ONE of the beauties of the BP/W system.

The STA can be purchased in a light configuration, standard, and a weighted. So if you'd normally have a 15 pound weightbelt, you can get an 8# STA, and put just 7 pounds on your belt. If you use 5 pounds in the water, you can get a standard STA and use 3 pounds on your belt. Etc.

The padding in a traditional BC takes extra weight just to sink it. Since the BP/W has no padding, you'll take weight off your belt right away. Since the SS Backplate is about 5#, you'll take that much off your weightbelt. Get it?

 

[CuriousRambler]

How about the STA then, say I get the weighted configuration, can I change that later to be light for diving in the tropics, or would I need to buy another STA all together?

Also, are there differences between one company's backplate/wing integration from another? For instance, could I put a Halcyon wing on an OMS backplate, or a DiveRite wing on a Deep Sea Supply plate? There's a pretty generic looking backplate on ebay for $60 Buy It Now, then there's a Halcyon backplate for $80 still taking bids. If I get the $60 plate, buy an Eclipse 40# wing alone, an STA, and a Hog harness, the harness can cost up to about $70 and cost the same as buying the rig all assembled. I forgot about the STA until I was typing this, thought I was going to save about $100 haha. Either way, the question of backplate vs. wing compatibility stands. Lastly, about how much does a Hog harness with all the hardware required cost? All I can find are harnesses with clips and disconnects, or just the webbing with no hardware, etc.

 

[cerich]

Thanks guys!

Mark: I'm looking at the Oceanic Chute and the Oceanic Probe. I'm not sure about the Chute because Oceanic doesn't have it on their site anymore, just checked it out in my LDS and I kind of like it, probably going to dive my AOW with it and see how it feels. Anyway, on Oceanic's site there's a double tank bracket available for about $120 in the accessories when you're looking at the Probe, as seen here.

I'll have to dig around and see if the Chute can take the same bracket or not. I've got my fingers crossed that maybe one of the local instructors is diving a BP/W so I can ask if they'll let me try it out. From what I've read and seen, I think I'd rather have a BP/W, but $500 isn't exactly casual money to me, so I want to be sure before I buy one, y'know?

I wear a BP/Wing with doubles. Do I need to spell this out????:huh:

 

[rongoodman]

The newer version of the Halcyon weighted STA is convertable. The weight just pops out and you attach the now unweighted STA. The Halcyon harness with all the hardware is about $65. It might be cheaper to buy the webbing and all the hardware pieces individually on the web.

 

[TheRedHead]

Cheetah, the idea thing would be an already-assembled, slightly-used BP and harness like this:

http://cgi.ebay.com/OMS-Steel-Back-...244807636QQcategoryZ16053QQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

 

[CuriousRambler]

Cheetah, the idea thing would be an already-assembled, slightly-used BP and harness like this:

That's why I was wondering if you can use any wing wtih any backplate. I noticed the plates seem to have a few holes in different positions, and the wings seem to have no holes in the same spots from the little I've examined them, so I was curious if I could get a cheap generic plate and put any wing I wanted to on it, etc.

Just to clarify, right now I'm just trying to figure out what I can and learn all I can about BP/W's - you've all hammered it into my head a few times over that they come out on top when compared to a jacket or back inflate BC, so I'm just trying to learn what I can so I can make an educated decision on what to buy.

 

[TheRedHead]

I think you can use any wing with a Dive Rite BP. But I'm not sure about the others.