Diver dead after accident in Lake Ontario near Oakville

[Dive Bug Bit Me]

ScubaSteve

OK but nobody has said officially what they are because the AOW was "disputed" by the adviserswife (sp?). So, if AOW was his cert level, then Tech Diver he was not. If he held some Tech certification levels, then one could somewhat accurately call him a Tech Diver.

Don't know too much about the circumstances and never knew the diver. We did, however, have a friend in common. Apparently the diver in question was enrolled in the Naui Intro to Tech course but had not completed it. (Postponed due to others in the group). Hence, to my mind not yet a tech diver.

Aside from that I am told his underwater skills were good.

 

[Ayisha]

TDI actually allows you to check to see if someone has taken a particular course. The basic starting point in TDI tech training is Advanced Nitrox and Decompression Procedures.

If you go to the link:

International Training :: Diver Services :: Confirm Certification

You can confirm whether anyone has taken a particular course by entering the name and selecting the course. If you enter my name "Warren Lo" and select Decompression Procedures, you can verify that I took the course and achieved the certification.

Hope this helps.

Ok, so we can confirm that T was not certified through TDI for any tech course.

Our GUE instructors and divers on Ontario Diving would know if he was GUE trained at a tech level.

So the latest info on his training is some portion of the NAUI Intro to Tech course. Does anyone know how much of that course he took if any?

 

[Ayisha]

An interesting tidbit that I think some may have overlooked is that (at least with PADI, I cannot be sure of any of the other recreational agencies since I was trained as a PADI instructor) a planned dive to 130 ft (or anything deeper than 100 ft) as part of a series of repetitive dives goes against PADI recommendations. It's clearly outlined on the back of the PADI RDP. If it was the only dive for the day, I don't think PADI says there's anything wrong with that, other than to avoid going to the limit of the planner.

Also Warren, isn't the recommended depth limit 100 feet for PADI AOW, rather than 130 feet? 130 feet is the recommended depth limit for those holding a deep diver certification. Although, the wreck in question currently sits at 145 feet. It is extremely cold water and should therefore be planned as 155 feet, to add to the mix.

 

[Ayisha]

If it was gear related...which I highly doubt...then depending on what it was, it could be maintenance. I doubt that it was gear related because he dove good gear and took care of it.

Gear related does not only mean the diver's maintenance of his equipment or the type of gear he was using. That's all for now.

 

[Country Diver]

Gear related does not only mean the diver's maintenance of his equipment or the type of gear he was using. That's all for now.

It was an example....nothing more.


On a side note...he was not GUE trained. If he was he would not have been there.

Intro to Tech is far from a tech course. It is a course that teaches divers how to use a long hose, and how to frog kick, and how to gain a little more control in the water column. It by no means gives a diver a tech rating beyond AOW. Some people think that when a diver has double tanks and they sling a stage bottle that they are tech divers. There are many recreational divers that find balance and flexibility with wearing doubles and stay within their limits of recreational dives. These divers sometimes carry a stage bottle or they call it a pony bottle. Many of these divers think that carrying a stage bottle makes them more "techy" and they want to fit in with the boys. Whatever the case, they are still AOW divers...nothing more and should know the boundaries of that certification. There is nothing down there worth pushing the limits for. Cowboy days are over and long gone. It is frowned on by people who respect the sport and the levels of training from all agencies, but yet, I still see some rogue cowboys out there, and they even post it as if bragging.

I always thought that AOW was to 130 ft, at least that's what I was told back when I had my card. If it had changed...then good for them. I have seen some AOW divers in my time and I wouldn't go 20 ft with them. Thumbed at the dock.

 

[DivingPrincessE]

OK but nobody has said officially what they are because the AOW was "disputed" by the adviserswife (sp?). So, if AOW was his cert level, then Tech Diver he was not. If he held some Tech certification levels, then one could somewhat accurately call him a Tech Diver.

I don't believe adiverswife has enough diving knowledge to accurately convey her husband's cert or experience level. I think if she knew she would have told us, instead of just calling everyone a liar. I don't think we can take her word that he was any sort of tech diver.

Don't know too much about the circumstances and never knew the diver. We did, however, have a friend in common. Apparently the diver in question was enrolled in the Naui Intro to Tech course but had not completed it. (Postponed due to others in the group). Hence, to my mind not yet a tech diver.

Aside from that I am told his underwater skills were good.

I agree with Country Diver. Even if he had finished the Intro to Tech course, that is a far cry from being a Tech Diver, from what I understand.

 

[boulderjohn]

An interesting tidbit that I think some may have overlooked is that (at least with PADI, I cannot be sure of any of the other recreational agencies since I was trained as a PADI instructor) a planned dive to 130 ft (or anything deeper than 100 ft) as part of a series of repetitive dives goes against PADI recommendations. It's clearly outlined on the back of the PADI RDP. If it was the only dive for the day, I don't think PADI says there's anything wrong with that, other than to avoid going to the limit of the planner.

Also Warren, isn't the recommended depth limit 100 feet for PADI AOW, rather than 130 feet? 130 feet is the recommended depth limit for those holding a deep diver certification. Although, the wreck in question currently sits at 145 feet. It is extremely cold water and should therefore be planned as 155 feet, to add to the mix.

I will just clarify the PADI information and add a little more to the technical diving information.

The AOW deep dive is supposed to be limited to 100 feet, and it is recommended that AOW divers stick to that limit. With the deep specialty, the recommendation extends to 130 feet. The 100 foot limit is routinely ignored, as it is only a recommendation.

The 130 foot limit is for all recreational divers and it is not merely a recommendation, because going deeper than that requires decompression and the knowledge/skills obtained through technical training.

I do not know what Warren is referencing from the back of the PADI RDP, with which I am quite familiar. Perhaps it is a reference to the WX and YZ rules, with deal with diving to limits on a day in which 3 or more dives are planned. These rules call for extended surface intervals between such dives. If the diver was diving in excess of 130 feet and using decompression procedures, the PADI RDP is not relevant, because it does not include decompression procedures. The diver would have to have been following a protocol other than the PADI RDP.

It was said previously that he had started a NAUI Intro to Tech class. I do not know the standards for NAUI into to tech, but having completed the equivalent courses (and beyond) for both TDI and UTD, I can tell you that decompression procedures are not studied at that level of certification. I am pretty sure NAUI is the same.

 

[Jimmer]

It was said previously that he had started a NAUI Intro to Tech class. I do not know the standards for NAUI into to tech, but having completed the equivalent courses (and beyond) for both TDI and UTD, I can tell you that decompression procedures are not studied at that level of certification. I am pretty sure NAUI is the same.

You are correct, I did the same Intro to Tech with the same instructor, and am supposed to be doing Deco procedures/Advanced Nitrox/Heliotrox in the spring with that instructor, and I believe the deceased was supposed to be in that class with me.

Jim

 

[Warren_L]

..........

I do not know what Warren is referencing from the back of the PADI RDP, with which I am quite familiar. Perhaps it is a reference to the WX and YZ rules, with deal with diving to limits on a day in which 3 or more dives are planned. These rules call for extended surface intervals between such dives. If the diver was diving in excess of 130 feet and using decompression procedures, the PADI RDP is not relevant, because it does not include decompression procedures. The diver would have to have been following a protocol other than the PADI RDP.

If you look under the general rules, it says "Limit repetitive dives to 100ft or shallower".

 

[David_57]

There seems to be a lot of discussion about his certification level/training, is this the cause of the accident or do we still have no idea?