DIR Doing Their Thang!

[GDI]

To Anyone who is a DIR/GUE instructor..
(What I am asking here is not nor should not be taken as a method to learning how to scuba dive)

In brief (because I understand that many of you earn a living at teaching this and I would not want you to fore go any chance of any income possibility).

1. Please explain the skills that you teach, the order and methodology of how you teach them. How are they different to others?
2. Please explain the academic curriculum and the reasons for it's particular administration (Deco planning process may be ommitted as I believe that all agencies share this information readily)
3. Please explain the complete lifestyle and philosophy principles of DIR, the requirements for all round physical fitness, health and personal habits
4. Please discuss the equipment thought process (so prevalent on many SB threads)The WHY's and HOW's you have determined to equipment configuration?

You believe you have built a better mouse trap. People laughed at PADI back in 1968 but by 1975 the statistics proved they had a more marketable system. The rest good or bad is history.

R.S.V.P

 

[Soggy]

http://www.gue.com/catalog/order

Check out "DIR The Fundamentals of Better Diving." It is a 150 page book that explains exactly what you want to know. That, combined with the standards document will get you started.

5 minutes of time spent searching will lead you to a ton of other information including trip reports, etc.

 

[Charlie99]

To Anyone who is a DIR/GUE instructor..
<list of questions snipped>

Course standards are posted at www.gue.com.

Scanning your many questions, I didn't see any that Jarrod Jablonski failed to cover in his book; "Doing it Right: The Fundamentals of better Diving" (available on the same website). I found this book well worth the time it took to carefully read, analyze, and consider the message -- even though I have no intention of taking a GUE course.

While you can find fervent, enthusiastic support of DIR on Scubaboard, going to the original source and reading what JJ says is a more direct way of getting the info.

Charlie Allen

 

[fgray1]

http://www.gue.com/catalog/order

Check out "DIR The Fundamentals of Better Diving." It is a 150 page book that explains exactly what you want to know. That, combined with the standards document will get you started.

5 minutes of time spent searching will lead you to a ton of other information including trip reports, etc.

I just read the fundamentals for DIR/GUE sounds like they took what you've been doing with your students and made a agency out of it. Having trained with you I know from personal experiance. Gee Your DIR and you didn't even know it.
OR should I say DIR/GUE are GDI. Sounds alot like common sense diving to me.
But then again I have one of the best instuctors out there teaching me. The only thing they need to work on is equiptment configuration. Maybe you can get them to come to you for some lessons.

Fred

 

[GDI]

soggy, chalie99 Thank-you

I know the website I have looked at it before and I will look at it again. However I would like to see (in brief) the Instructor teaching standards, how they are to teach their skills. PADI, NAUI, SDI, etc. they all have them. We all have liability in teaching. Put them up for the world to see and then lets compare.

 

[jplacson]

Right now, I see GUE stuck between a rock and a hard place. They try their best to stick to their guns, at the same time, need resources to further their business... enter Halcyon. :lol:

I think that since the birth of Halcyon... DIR has gotten more 'it's just a marketing ploy' comments than ever before... I can understand why they price things the way they do, right now, I think Halcyon is the major cash flow of GUE and the like. And logically so, if your philosophy is to not accept just anyone to train... then you have to turn to retail to make money.

Now I'm not against Halcyon btw, my entire rig is from Halcyon, down to every bolt and wing nut... not because I think their wing nuts are better than everyone else's... but I simply like their products. I think, a wing is a wing, is a wing. If it doesn't leak... then it's good.

Now, regarding DIR... I have noticed a global trend. DIR divers are viewed as arrogant and irritable (in general) ... my main dive buddies are all DIR. They are all very nice, and accomodating. But the funny thing is, most of the bickering starts from the other agencies who bash DIR to sway students/divers to buy equipement or classes from their own shop. The sales pitch always starts something like this, "Halcyon is too bare bones, you pay so much for so little...look at this new BC we have, same price...but you get more features!" ... OR "We also teach Hogarthian methods... but unlike DIR, we are more flexible so we are willing to learn as well".

It's funny though... I think GUE/DIR/Halcyon people really are arrogant... rightfully so, but still arrogant. And the other agencies play this up and use it to their advantage. As you can see from my signature, I'm not GUE or DIR in any way... yet. But I do applaude them for trying their best to produce the best divers in the world... not just doing a 2-hour cert course...and pushing another diver in the water to make a quick buck.

The one thing I find annoying is that, most OW divers don't have their buoyancy figured out. I still see 'experienced' divers flailing their arms about. I'm not saying all non-GUE divers are bad... there are a whole lot of you out there who are excellent divers... but that's just my point... it's a hit-and-miss thing.

I've dove with much more experienced divers than myself... and I see most of them doing major saw-toothed profiles... one minute their 10 ft below me, the next, 10 feet above me... next their clinging onto a coral to poke a fish trying to hide...etc..etc...

Now, PADI (since I have no experience with other OW training systems) has decent training materials... books, CD-ROMs, videos...etc..etc. They all teach the right things... proper buoyancy, trim, respect for UW life, and all that...and it's all good... LEGALLY. But they don't seem to care whether a student has adopted these lessons or not... as long as you can breathe of your regulator, and can clear your mask... ok, you're certified! Even proper finning isn't stressed... somehow, the dentist in Finding Nemo comes to mind! :lol:

I guess this is why GUE is so strict about DIRF classes and I've heard that some instructors from other agencies fail this class as well... this is probably what brings out a lot of bitterness towards GUE as well.

Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is that most DIR divers are not as bad as a lot of people claim they are...they may not be the most humble people on the planet..hehehe... but they are exceptionally good divers. I haven't seen a single 'bad' DIRF (GUE Tech & Cave divers not included) diver... but I've seen countless 'bad' PADI/NAUI divers, complete with flailing arms, and coral-damaging hands. And for me, they must be good to produce divers that disciplined... I'm scheduled for DIRF next year.

 

[O-ring]

Halcyon and GUE have absolutely nothing to do with one another other than the fact that they share a CEO/President. Jarrod has debunked this rumor personally on scubaboard and continuing to perpetuate that rumor is foolhardy.

See here - http://www.scubaboard.com/t36855.html and do a search for posts by user "jarrod"

 

[MikeFerrara]

Now, PADI (since I have no experience with other OW training systems) has decent training materials... books, CD-ROMs, videos...etc..etc. They all teach the right things... proper buoyancy, trim, respect for UW life, and all that...and it's all good... LEGALLY. But they don't seem to care whether a student has adopted these lessons or not... as long as you can breathe of your regulator, and can clear your mask... ok, you're certified! Even proper finning isn't stressed... somehow, the dentist in Finding Nemo comes to mind! :lol:[/B]

This really isn't true. Name a PADI text that explains trim. Name a PADI text that explains the mechanics of trim or the importance of it. Name a performance requirement in any PADI class that requires students to be properly trimmed. You can't because they don't. The texts use pretty colors and good grammer but they are empty of content.

I guess this is why GUE is so strict about DIRF classes and I've heard that some instructors from other agencies fail this class as well... this is probably what brings out a lot of bitterness towards GUE as well.

They don't just do poorly. They often don't do any better than new divers and others with far less "training".

Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is that most DIR divers are not as bad as a lot of people claim they are...they may not be the most humble people on the planet..hehehe... but they are exceptionally good divers. I haven't seen a single 'bad' DIRF (GUE Tech & Cave divers not included) diver... but I've seen countless 'bad' PADI/NAUI divers, complete with flailing arms, and coral-damaging hands. And for me, they must be good to produce divers that disciplined... I'm scheduled for DIRF next year.

Not only do we see a lot of bad divers but it's extremely rare to see a good one in our local sites and many other places I've dived. I'm defining bad as one who obviously doesn't have a handle on the basics that allow them to control their position in the water and stay with and aware of a buddy. Any more if you do see some one who can dive they are most often a mamber of a local bunch of DIR divers/students who practice and dive together.

As far as attitude, there's some on both sides. I met MHK at Haigh while I was teaching a class there and he invited me to sit in on his class. Since I was teaching I was only able to be there for a small portion. Later Brandon invited me to sit in on an entire class that he had scheduled. Now, I might be viewed as competition but yet the invitation. I sat through the lectures and buddied up with the videographer for the dives. Nice folks, good divers and good instructors. While some of their students might feel cheated once they see what diving can be like and try real hard to pass it on I can't say that I've noticed a bad or unfreindly attitude being a common trait among DIR divers.

There are several others who are very DIR that I dive with on a regular basis and mostly they avoid conversations like this and just go diving.

I like diving and socializing with them just fine and don't see a problem with any of the procedures we follow on those dives. The gasses, team management, equipment configuration, decompression, the way stage bottles are managed...all good. I still choose to not use any labels for myself other than the ones I was given at birth though. LOL

 

[jiveturkey]

You have the "Sting" models...they glow orange when strokes are nearby..

LOL...Bilbo is a cavediver!

 

[jplacson]

O-ring, I know... I followed that thread a while back as well... but honestly... the fact that they share a Pres/CEO means that they share philosophies as well, unless JJ is 2-faced, which I seriously doubt he is. He answered a few emails I sent Halcyon a while back and he's very friendly and patient.

My point is, you can't believe that Halcyon & GUE don't have anything to do with each other when most of the people in Halcyon are GUE divers. They may not be legal partners...but doesn't Halcyon already own the "DIR" tag? (Last I heard they applied for a patent on that) I know GUE doesn't require Halcyon products or anything like that... and even some of Halcyon's products aren't DIR (I've heard that the MC side pocket they sell isn't DIR since it's belt mounted, and zippered) ... but they are closely bound... whether it's official or not.

If most of Halcyon's employees are GUE divers, then these GUE divers (specially if they are they higher-up GUE instructors) make most of their money from Halcyon, not from GUE... thus freeing them from the pressure of increasing student or intructor numbers just to make a living. This allows them to maintain the high standards of GUE, without feeling the financial pinch as much. One way or the other, Halcyon helps GUE out.

Mike, at the time I took my PADI class, trim wasn't discussed at all... just weights. But I recently sat in my former instructors class and the new 'video' shows the basic concepts of trim..and explains how it affects diver position. Mind you, the whole part on trim was a total of 20 seconds in the video... it was still "discussed". My point was, just because it's in the text, or other insructional material, that doesn't mean that all the students get it. A lot of the divers I've met on this board go out of their way to learn more than what their cert courses have taught them! And that's very admirable... but that trait isn't found in most divers. Most don't even remember how to inflate their BC properly... holding the inflate button down like it was an emergency brake or something. Their BC 'breathes' as much air as they do with how often they inflate & deflate! hehehehe

Quote "This really isn't true. Name a PADI text that explains trim. Name a PADI text that explains the mechanics of trim or the importance of it. Name a performance requirement in any PADI class that requires students to be properly trimmed. You can't because they don't. The texts use pretty colors and good grammer but they are empty of content.

That's the problem... PADI doesn't require it... but it does mention (briefly) how to trim yourself by adjusting the location of your weights. That's all.

That's why I admire GUE for requiring these things because these should be basic skills.. not recommended skills. The fact that their c-cards expire shows their commitment to their standards since they require constant proof of skills for renewal.

A bit off-topic, a local site here by Philtech Divers (I think they're IANTD) say they don't "Do It Right"... they "Do It Better".