DIR controversy?

[lamont]

Why don't you talk to JJ and ask him if OOG without a buddy is a scenario that is so remote it is "worthless." - I would bet dollars to doughnuts he would say you need to have a plan for every contingency.

Uh, I'll take that bet. If you've got a deco obligation and you are OOG without a buddy you are bent/dead. He'll tell you to get a better buddy, be a better buddy and practice your gas planning.

Really, when you're doing deco or overhead you just can't let that kind of thing happen. If it does happen you're dead. If you think that's overconfident, then you shouldn't be doing tech diving. Many people think techdivers are crazy. I used to be one of them.

 

[H2Andy]

Really, when you're doing deco or overhead you just can't let that kind of thing happen. If it does happen you're dead.

well, you might get lucky and get out of it, but who wants to rely on luck?

absolutely true as to overhead. the only reason you go into that cave is because
your buddy is there with you to provide emergency air. if my buddy dies halfway
through, i'll grab him and drag him out because i may need his air.

i'll fall apart when i get to the surface.

 

[JeffG]

if your buddy dies halfway
through, i'll grab him and drag him out because i may need his air.

He also might have the car keys.

 

[jonnythan]

Uh, I'll take that bet. If you've got a deco obligation and you are OOG without a buddy you are bent/dead.

And that doesn't matter if you're DIR or not.

2nd point - again, this is in the context of what another poster said about never needing to do air shares or OOG - if that were the case, then all you would need is a short enough hose to go from reg to mouth

I'm not sure who would have said something like that, but the reason DIR divers train and practice various OOA scenarios all the time is that it happens sometimes. It's pretty much inexcusable to run OOG barring some dramatic mechanical failure, but it can still happen and we are still prepared for it.

 

[Kim]

He also might have the car keys.

Hmmm...that's an interesting one. Where's the DIR place for car keys?

 

[JeffG]

I'm not sure who would have said something like that

No one said it. He was twisting words. He just wants to debate, but he isn't doing good job of it because he lacks fundamental understanding of what DIR is.

 

[minnesota01r6]

People keep saying that rec divers will go for the brightly colored octo in the triangle. But in reality, many PADI (and SSI and NAUI) shops peddle the "Aii II" as a standard piece of equipment, and new students are taught to head for the primary. Actually, even an "octo" trained rec diver is likely to head for the primary as well in a OOG panic, making DIR OOG practices in reality more compatible across the board with other agencies.

Which also makes the poster's complaint **to which I originally responded** that the octo being stored in the golden triangle makes for bad OOG breathing all that more absurd, because the diver who has it stowed (wherever it is in the triangle) presumably would know where it is, and the OOG buddy would grab the primary.

RedHead - yes, it was absurd the moment someone suggested that a lack of a uniform place to put an octo was a major downfall of classical rec training since an OOG diver will go for the primary anyway (see above). It became more absurd when you said "I think OOG is the result of a poorly thought out dive. We should be taught how NOT to run out of gas in the first place."

Johhnthan - see the posts where lamont called thinking about contingencies "worthless" because his training would never allow him to get in that situation.

Lamont - I asked a simple question about OOG between a DIR and non-DIR diver. It has been perverted by your dodging to the point where responding to your posts has now become "worthless"

 

[JeffG]

Hmmm...that's an interesting one. Where's the DIR place for car keys?

When you are driving...the ignition.

 

[lamont]

And that doesn't matter if you're DIR or not.


I'm not sure who would have said something like that, but the reason DIR divers train and practice various OOA scenarios all the time is that it happens sometimes. It's pretty much inexcusable to run OOG barring some dramatic mechanical failure, but it can still happen and we are still prepared for it.

You can also have an "OOG" that is a failure to access gas rather than running out of it. Valves that are off / rolled off, regulators that are broken, mouthpieces coming off, that kind of thing...

 

[lamont]

Lamont - I asked a simple question about OOG between a DIR and non-DIR diver. It has been perverted by your dodging to the point where responding to your posts has now become "worthless"

yeah, its bumping up my post count though...

i'm nearly at 2,500...

surely we can keep beating this horse for awhile longer.... its not a bloody pulp yet...