DIR and tech?

[Iguana Don]

Rick,

Those that you speak of, treat DIR as a religion instead of a philosophy. I hope I didn't offend you in any way eith my above post. This is just my opinion for what it's worth.
Personally I have started using it all the time and find it much more comfortable than my BC. Just a matter of preferenc I guess.

ID

 

[turnerjd]

Originally posted by Rick Murchison
I have no problems with DIR - think it's a great way to go. There are those who feel it is the *only* way to go, and with these folks I disagree, especially for recreational diving. DIR purists would junk much of what we use for comfort and convenience in the recreational world - where diving's supposed to be fun. But even for tech I find the Transpac II and a modified Hogarthian rig suits me better than a strictly DIR one. I'm sure George & Co would call me a "stroke" - oh, well, I've been called worse.
Rick

Rick,

I'm in full agreement with you on this one. DIR has its place in diving, and I think that for the vast majority of divers this is just plain unnecessary. If you are doing real cave explorations or really deep penetration wreck diving then this is probably a good way to go.

There is a level below this, which I suspect is where I am, I can through my BSAC (or now the French MN90) tables do decompression diving down to 60m on air if I want to. I've done 53, and survived. I've done all the necesary training for this kind of decompression diving. In this case, rather than having DIR thrust upon you, you should have enough experience and knowledge to be able to sort out your own setup. But, people diving in this area also need flexibility in their equipment. Being happy and comfortable with your own equipment is more important than doing that George & Co insist as being the only way. I've dived the long hose, and used a backplate and harness, but for me, these are not right, I don't like them, and probably never will.

For deep decompression diving-
Do I need to dive a long hose? - I don't think so, provided I have all the necessary support stations set up etc.. (tanks at stop depths), If I have to ascent with someone using my AAS then we are in real trouble, as almost all the people I dive with use isolatable twins, and occasionally a 3L pony bottle as well to get upto our first airstation if there is any thought of separating. If I wreck penetrated this deep I won't go in with a buddy, but that is a different story. Redundancy!

Do I need a harness / backplate?
I need buoyancy, and some way of attaching it to me. At depth, task loading is important. Unless I am diving every day, then I want minimum task loading. I want to minimise kit changes. Go with what's most comfortable for you as this reduces your task loading.

Just a brief attemt to rationalise my kit, and the thoughts behing it.

Jon T

 

[ericfine50]

Jon,

The long hose is not just for deep or cave. It is designed to hand off to your buddy in case they have a problem. That 7 foot distance is enough to exit a cave or wreck in single file (if need be). I find it is no different than when I used a standard length hose.

The backplate/wings system is clean, slick, and for about $15 you can reweb it every few years (if you need to)

Personally, I don't think 60m on air is a good thing. That is what tri mix is for. I would like to remember my dive and be clear headed during it.

Eric

 

[turnerjd]

I don't think it is good either, I have done 53m, but having done that I haven't since been below 42m however, my qualifications allow me to do it, and a lot of people I know do it.

This is one of the differences between european and US diving. The Dsat TecRec Deep course brings divers into line with the european equivalent of the AOW course (ie after second course, EG BSAC Sport diver). Deep diving is commonplace here, almost all charter boat skippers have all the kit for decompression diving, and probably more than 80% of sea dives done here are air decompression dives. The general attitude in the UK is that somewhere between 50 and 60 is where you need to change from air to Trimix, although we have our fair share of deep air nutters.

I certainly wouldn't consider trimix for dives between 30-45m, as I do this regularly on air, and with regular practice, and all the relevant systems in place is not too dangerous.

As for the long hose, I just don't like having all that hose wrapped round me!

Jon T

 

[ericfine50]

Can I ask why? The 7ft or 5 ft (Open water) goes across the chest, once around the head/shoulders and into your mouth. It is not going to choke you.

Just curious, not trying to be a jerk

Eric

 

[turnerjd]

There is no reason that is easily said, I tried it, and after a year or so of not needing the extra length (5ft), and getting fed up with removing it from my reg when I was DMing and replacing it for normal diving, I just got utterley fed up with it. I also didn't find it overly comfortable.

I tried using the round the body technique, and a couple of other non standard storage techniques, but at the end of the day I just decided that it wasn't for me.

Jon T

 

[WetDane]

hi Jon T,

that's interesting, up here it seems that the 7 foot hose is just the standard setup - I have yet to see anyone replace it for OW - we don't have any caves here (to my knowledge) so you'll see full DIR specs used in open water...

Anyway - thanks for the great comments - I'm happy with the Trasnpac I have, and I'm happy that I can replace the harness with a backplate - should I desire to...
The closest shop for me is 5th Dimension which is a total DIR shop - so the EE canisters are 10 minutes away - Pro6 w/ 10W HID is still about $600 though... Oh well - I think it is more a matter of time than anything else...

Cheers,
Terkel

 

[large_diver]

Hi WetDane,

I am a relative newbie. Not DIR, but am trying to adapt my rig to include certain elements of DIR. I also bought a bunch of gear before starting to read DIR material -- as a result, this is a step by step conversion ($$$).

Many folks that I've talked to in the US who are OW-only divers will substitute the 7ft for a 5ft hose -- the reasoning being that the 7ft was developed for cave and wreck penetration situations. In an open water air-sharing scenario, the 7ft is overkill. I myself will likely adopt this config with a necklaced back-up when I buy a new reg this spring.

 

[turnerjd]

WetDane,

You are going about this absolutely the right way. IMO there is no need to go out and change completely to DIR. As you talk about doing OW dives, I would suspect the DIR isn't even absolutely necessary.

DIR comes from people like JJ (Jarod Jablonski) and others doing deep cave diving. Unless you are doing this kind of diving, then you can take the best of both systems. I like the comfort of my old BC, so I have adapted that, and I don't like diving the long hose, so I don't do that.

Provided you aren't doing any totally mad dives, then it doesn't matter if you DIR or have a recreational setup. Whynot use the best of both?

Jon T

 

[Atomox]

This is interesting. My wife was still using a standard length regulator hose when our two oldest kids were old enough to be certified a few years ago. She told me one day prior to the kids pool class that she would be diving with them in the pool and during the certification dives and that she wanted a longer hose for the alternate reg in case of the need to share air. She said that the regular length hose was not suitable to donate air and control the situation if the OOA diver was panicking. So I explained the concept of donating the primary and having the backup reg on a necklace. She immediately recognized the advantages to this configuration and has adopted it. (I have since moved her into a BP/wing, a dry suit and doubles.) At no time has she or the kids indicated that the 7 foot hose was a problem or uncomfortable. I was fortunate that I have been diving with the instructor for some time and he was familiar with DIR and did not have a problem with it.

I can also say that I have all of us (my family) diving with helium. I go over in detail with all of them the need for proper gas management and deco stops even on “NDL” rec dives. To me the difference is noticeable and I would not consider doing a dive greater than 100ft/30m on air anymore. I can do this because I have a compressor and the necessary setup to do continuous blending of trimix for any mix that I want. My biggest concern any more is that I can not implement this type of diving on our vacations.

Brad