Den Laman questions

[diverrex]

Thinking about taking our first trip to Bonaire this May and so far Den Laman is at the top of our list. Looking for a place a little more upscale without being crazy expensive. A few questions:

1. We're looking at the 2 BR oceanfront unit on the corners. Is there any issue from noise or cigar smoke from the restaurant below? We're not party poopers or anything but we do enjoy having drinks on the balcony in the evening in relative peace and quiet, and do absolutaley hate cigar smoke.

2. I thought I heard once that Den Laman guests can use the Sand Dollar pool? Is that true?

3. I know it's heresy to talk about boat diving on Bonaire but my wife is just not into lugging gear around. And since I photograph I think she likes having a quide around. Though I do plan on getting her out on some Bari Reef dives from Den Laman and maybe a few other spots how is Bonaire D & A as a boat dive op? I've heard a few mixed reports about their diver friendliness.

4. While my wife might be a little wimpy about lugging gear around for a shore dive I could definitely get her to do some east side diving with Bonaire East Coast Diving. Anyone dive with them and have any comments?

5. I've heard a few complaints about a crowded dive storage area at Den Laman. Any comments? Would May be less crowded than high season?

6 Our recent trips have included Grand Cayman, Dominica, Cozumel, Curacao and Belize. Anyone who has been to any of those want to compare Bonaire diving? Not the shore diving freedom, I totally get that advantage, I'm mostly interested in the quantity and variety of sea life and the condition of the reefs.

Thanks for any replies.

 

[Mossman]

1. We were there once when the restaurant was rented out for a wedding, but even though it was noisy outdoors, you couldn't hear a thing inside the room. I can't recall ever smelling cigar smoke from the balconies, but it's certain a possibility if there isn't a breeze around to clear away the smell (it's also possible you could be on the third floor with a cigar smoker directly under you, but that could happen just about anywhere).

2. I've heard that too (the pool supposedly belongs to the Sunrise Restaurant, not Sand Dollar), but we never bothered to walk over and try it out.

3. The one time I ever had a need to speak with Andre for any length of time, he was perfectly polite, if not actually friendly. Maybe I caught him at a good time. The thing is, since the gear room is close to the parking lot and so are the tanks, and the walk from the truck to the water at many shore dive sites is actually shorter than the walk from the gear room down the dock to the boats, shore diving can paradoxically require less gear lugging than boat diving on Bonaire. Her argument about wanting an extra "buddy" while you're shooting photos makes plenty of sense, but I hope you can at least convince her to try one of the easier shore dive sites and lug her gear yourself if you have to - Bari Reef is fine, and supposedly the most diverse, but the terrain and reef health are better at many other shore spots IMO.

5. We've seen it crowded, when it was hard to find an empty wetsuit hangar and less considerate people tried encroaching their gear on OUR space, but BDA was responsive to our complaint by putting out some more hangars and moving the offending divers' stuff.

6. I'd imagine you'll find it closest to Curacao, though I haven't been there myself. I think the north wall dives on Grand Cayman are more pristine, but Bonaire seems to have more fish. Cozumel has better viz and swimthroughs if those are your thing, but the reefs start too deep IMO (likewise with Belize) - Bonaire allows for longer dives (and/or more dives) simply because you can enjoy much of the dive in the shallows and take on less (or offgas more) nitrogen. A lot of the sites, especially to the south, have plenty to see right at 15 feet, on the swim back to the entry point, so "safety" stops are actually as nice as any other part of the dive and definitely no hardship to prolong. Also I prefer Bonaire's diversity over Belize/Cozumel - the southern Caribbean has more to offer IMO.

 

[diversteve]

Our recent trips have included Curacao... Anyone who has been to any of those want to compare Bonaire diving?

I could drop you on certain sites on either island where you couldn't tell the difference. Fans, corals, schools of blue fish etc. Both islands are located on the same reef. A couple dives into our week on Curacao I told my friends this is what Bonaire is like also.

If you've been to any of these sites on Curacao: Playa's Kalki, Jeremi, Lagun, Nos Kas or Varsenbaai - a lot of Bonaire will look similar. There's nothing similar to Mushroom Forest on Bonaire that we ever saw. Some of the dive areas on Bonaire - both north and south of town - are very similar to the double reef structure found at Porto Mari.

Biggest advantage is there's no long swim out to the reef in most areas. Most Bonaire sites have more difficult entries also - there's typically not a lot of nice beach. It's almost like the Bonaire waterline is physically a couple hundred yards closer to the reef than Curacao if that makes sense - you don't have the sandy beach cove swimouts on Bonaire like at a site like Jeremi or Lagun on Curacao.

You also won't have any dive facilities - or in most cases even houses - at any of the Bonaire shore dive sites not located adjacent to a dive resort or in "town".

We saw lots of moray/spotted eels, schools of squid, flounder in the shallows, turtles etc. More turtles, esp. around Klein than anywhere we dove on Curacao. Of the two islands, the only place I've seen seahorses is Curacao. Not that they aren't often spotted on Bonaire.

I also think that there's a lot more stuff closer in to the beach on Bonaire. On Curacao I did longer surface swims over basically nothing till the edge of the reef. 40' off Bari Reef you can start the fish count - if you do one.

Generally speaking the reefs are healthier on Bonaire, there's more fish and I never saw any man-made junk like we did off Curacao. Nothing like Carpile on Bonaire either. I think the port and refinery traffic do damage to the reef around Willemsted.

There's also nothing like the piers on Curacao - at least where we dove. At night the profusion of fire cup coral on Town Pier is unbelievable. Salt Pier is also good during the day for the amount of stuff living/growing on the pier structure itself - it's a little more barren away from the pier though.

Playa Kalki on Curacao is the best dive I've ever done on either island, Angel City or Forest (Klein) on Bonaire is second.

We did boat dives 4/6 days on Bonaire in the morning. You can't really do any of the 25 Klein sites any other way and Rappel is only a boat dive - and one of the better dives we did. I think you can only dive Small Wall via boat also.

 

[skynscuba]

I've only been in the 2nd floor ocean front 1BR, two separate trips. Restaurant noise was never really noticed. It was more of a quiet semi-elegant restaurant, not a noisy crowd type of eatery.

I haven't made a boat dive in Bonaire, but I get the impression that the BDA boats are not as comfortably set up as the ones I'm used to other places. For instance, I don't think they have the tank racks at the back of each diver for gearing up and down. I don't think that it is "valet diving" either, but the tanks are available on the dock (not sure whether they already have them loaded for you, but they are right there close by). On the upside, the boats I've seen going out were not crammed full with divers, and dive sites are close, so it will be a nice quick boat ride there and back, and boat dives are pretty cheap on Bonaire, probably due to the short runs.

Storage space is tight in the gear room. When I was there in August one year, it was more crowded than when I was there in October another year. I don't know whether May will be busy, but I expect less so than August or winter.

Two repeated complaints I've heard, with validity, it that the BDA briefing takes too long (reportedly up to 90 minutes, where 45 minutes would be more appropriate), and that they need to change the water in the rinse tanks much more often. These are things they could fix immediately, but apparently don't see the need.

I'll be back at Den Laman in couple of months, for my 3rd visit.

 

[ShoeAddict]

My husband and I are returning to Bonaire and Den laman for our 3rd trip at the end of the month This is despite Continental Airlines "misplacing" our bags for a day or two. (One bag the first time... both bags the second time, so much for that idea of "cross packing" a little. YES, I'm still bitter with the airline.) The island and the stay at Den laman were so enjoyable that I couldn't imagine wanting to try another place on the island. Our visits have been in March and February.... so this might be a trip where we find the island to be a little more busy???? (in 3 more week...the Week before Easter).

I have read a few complaints about BDA but from my experience---> they have really treated us well. We actually took our advanced open water courses with them. They don't dote over you but if you really needed help with something don't hesitate to ask. For boat diving, you sign up on the chalkboard, you bring your own gear down to the dock...... I'm not great at estimating distances but if you walk 120 ft from the gear room to the end the pier ... you probably hit the water. Your gear is pretty safe on the dock so one of us usually made two trips to the locker (to get the integrated weight pouches that we didn't want to lug down the first trip). There is a tank locker right next to the dock (but they do lock it up in late afternoon). The boat diving is not "valet diving"-- (Blue XT Sea in Cozumel has the best valet diving I have ever experienced ) For boat diving, Air Tanks are loaded for you; you grab, check and label your own labelled nitrox bottle and bring it down close to the boat on the dock. They load it on the boat. When the boat reaches the mooring. Each person receives his /her tank to set up their own gear which you have stored under your seat.

I found that they changed the water in the rinse tanks more often here than they did when we were at Stuart Coves in the Bahamas so its all relative. There is a specific camera tank near the outdoor fresh water showers.

"The thing is, since the gear room is close to the parking lot and so are the tanks, and the walk from the truck to the water at many shore dive sites is actually shorter than the walk from the gear room down the dock to the boats, shore diving can paradoxically require less gear lugging than boat diving on Bonaire."

I completely agree with Mossman.

One useful thing I found with BDA that In addition to 80s', they have 63 cubics. I am a petite woman. With an 80, I struggle a bit with loose coral and some awkward shore entry sites. Jerry "The naturalist at BDA" (whose class we highly recommend) pointed out that I might be better off with a 63 and he was sooo right!!! (Less weight on my back and less lead in my pockets.) They have them in both air and nitrox. We did a lot of boat diving on our first trip and more shore diving with a few boat dives on our second trip. We have not tried wild side diving yet but we are considering it as a possibility for this trip, so I too am interested in hearing some more recent reviews.

I highly recommend the water view rooms (we stay in the one bedrooms). There is nothing like sitting out on the balcony in the morning with a cup of coffee or in the afternoon with a "Bright" (local beer), looking out at the water and the sunset behind Klein.

The restaraunt never got very roudy. If you are boat diving and intend to eat from the restaraunt in between dives...put your order in as soon as the boat gets back. Good food ...it just takes a little while. (we often grabbed "take out" from the restaraunt and ate on our balcony.)

I'll write a trip report when we return. We're taking Delta this time

 

[DiveMaven]

1. We're looking at the 2 BR oceanfront unit on the corners. Is there any issue from noise or cigar smoke from the restaurant below? We're not party poopers or anything but we do enjoy having drinks on the balcony in the evening in relative peace and quiet, and do absolutaley hate cigar smoke.

We've stayed in both a 1-bedroom oceanfront, and ocean-view "studio". The studio was on the 2nd floor the 1-bedroom on the 3rd floor. Never once was noise or smells a problems from the restaurant below. Keep in mind that the buildings are concrete and built very solidly. As a matter of fact, I can't remember hearing noise from downstairs even when I was hanging out on the veranda.

We've loved our 2 previous stays at Den Laman so much that we're returning for another 2 week visit this summer....in a 1-bedroom oceanfront...it's well worth the extra expense IMO.

2. I thought I heard once that Den Laman guests can use the Sand Dollar pool? Is that true?

I'd heard that too though never bothered since we're diving 4x a day usually.

3. I know it's heresy to talk about boat diving on Bonaire but my wife is just not into lugging gear around. And since I photograph I think she likes having a quide around. Though I do plan on getting her out on some Bari Reef dives from Den Laman and maybe a few other spots how is Bonaire D & A as a boat dive op? I've heard a few mixed reports about their diver friendliness.

We've done the boat diving with BDA and it was fine though we thought the guide went a bit fast (my husband is a photographer) and we didn't like being limited to a 60 minute dive. But compared to boat dives in other parts of the world we've done, I'd say it's pretty typical. We've found the staff at BDA to be friendly and helpful in the past 2 years we've gone. We're not sure if it's because we're there during low season so they're less harried, or if we're just a bit more easy going than others....

4. While my wife might be a little wimpy about lugging gear around for a shore dive I could definitely get her to do some east side diving with Bonaire East Coast Diving. Anyone dive with them and have any comments?

We went out with them last year and although I'm glad we did it, we won't be returning for a second trip. It's really nice that they bring you back to Lac Bay for the surface interval, and considering how uncomfortable the boat is and what a rough ride it can be, it's appreciated as far as I'm concerned. There aren't any bathrooms at Lac Bay....or at least the ones they have are ones you'd NEVER want to use (non-flushing toilets full of poo and no TP).

Another option that's available now is Buddy Dive's 3-tank all-day charter up to Washington Park's tough to access sites. The cost includes lunch and the boat is supposed to be large and comfortable. We're definitely going to be booking it this summer since we really want to dive up in the park but don't want to drive.

5. I've heard a few complaints about a crowded dive storage area at Den Laman. Any comments? Would May be less crowded than high season?

We've gone for 2-week stays during the past 2 Julys. The first year the storage area was very crowded and we had to share a peg. It was a bit of a hassle, but not that big of a deal since we brought some stuff up to our room. Last year the storage room was EMPTY and we each had a peg and more than enough room. It turned out that we only used the gear room for our sopping wet gear since we took it up to our room after dinner every night so we could leave early in the morning to dive.

The storage room doesn't open until 8:30, same with tanks. Nitrox tanks are locked up at 4:30, so you have to plan ahead if you're going to dive nitrox in the evenings, early mornings, or night. There are wooden lockers you can stash a couple of tanks in easy, but they don't have locks so you wouldn't want to leave gear in them.

6 Our recent trips have included Grand Cayman, Dominica, Cozumel, Curacao and Belize. Anyone who has been to any of those want to compare Bonaire diving? Not the shore diving freedom, I totally get that advantage, I'm mostly interested in the quantity and variety of sea life and the condition of the reefs..

We've dived Belize, but since we did it by liveaboard, we were able to go out to more pristine sites than the ones most folks go to. When we went to a site that was accessable by day boat, the difference in the condition of the reef was startling. I'd say that Bonaire and Belize are very similar in the amount of macro you can find. We saw bigger fish in Belize, but the number of juveniles we've seen in Bonaire is absolutely amazing. To me they're both excellent places with similarities, but have different pluses and minuses, so are hard to compare.

 

[ShoeAddict]

"Buddy Dive's 3-tank all-day charter up to Washington Park" I heard that they were having some problems with their boat. Anybody have an update?

 

[diverrex]

The boat diving is not "valet diving"-- (Blue XT Sea in Cozumel has the best valet diving I have ever experienced )

Yes, Blue Xt Sea in Cozumel is great, you don't touch your gear after the first day you drop it off. Ocean Frontiers in Grand Cayman is just as good on the "valet" treatment, they just run bidgger boats with more divers than the nice six-packs Christi runs.

 

[diverrex]

"Buddy Dive's 3-tank all-day charter up to Washington Park" I heard that they were having some problems with their boat. Anybody have an update?

I heard the same thing, any updates? I'd consider that trip if it was running.

 

[DeputyDan]

Den Laman will be a good choice.
Herman always stays in the 2 bedroom right above the restaurant - you can PM him about any issues.
He keeps going back so it must be AOK!
We have stayed in the 2-bedroom on the other corner and loved it - would go again and stay there in a heartbeat!