Deet and other pesticides hurting the reef?

[Ayisha]

I totally agree with RTB's point of view. DEET is proven safe beyond the shadow of a doubt for human use.

It is not true that DEET is proven to be safe. I don't know about the U.S. or elsewhere, but in Canada, you can no longer buy any DEET products over a 30% concentration. DEET is apparently not a carcinogenic, but it is toxic. This is some of the information given:

Products containing DEET at concentrations above 30% will no longer be acceptable for registration, based on a human health risk assessment that considered daily application of DEET over a prolonged period of time. Studies show that products with lower concentrations of DEET are as effective as the high concentration products, but they remain so for shorter periods of time. Products containing no more than a 30% concentration of DEET will provide adults with sufficient protection. (New advice)

bold added

Re-evaluation Decision Document: Personal insect repellents containing DEET (N,N-diethyl-m-toluamide and related compounds)

 

[RTBDiver]

It is not true that DEET is proven to be safe. I don't know about the U.S. or elsewhere, but in Canada, you can no longer buy any DEET products over a 30% concentration. DEET is apparently not a carcinogenic, but it is toxic. This is some of the information given:

bold added

Re-evaluation Decision Document: Personal insect repellents containing DEET (N,N-diethyl-m-toluamide and related compounds)

It's good to know that after more studies that deet is still considered safe in concentrations of less than 30 % and in lesser concentrations is still approved for use on children as young as 6 months, especially considering that the higher concentrations have been shown not to really work better but only longer so reapplication may be needed. Considering it is still one of the best options when it comes to insect repellant its good to know our neighbors to the north feel it is a very safe option. Your post from Canadian Health also mention "extended periods of time" Can you perhapse post the link that may expalin what this extended period of time is?
Also, do these Canadian studies have any option that is known to work as good and proven to be any safer?
Thanls

 

[rtbmediver]

[Coral-List] Posting regarding DEET being detrimental to corals Inbox X Coral List_DEET X
West End Sandy Bay Marine Park to coral-list
show details May 15 (4 days ago)

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The Roatan Marine Park has always informed its visitors that they should not wear DEET and then enter the sea as it proves to be toxic and damaging for the reef and its inhabitants.
We are now being questioned and would like to provide people with scientific evidence to back our claims. Please provide us with links high lighting the detrimental effects that DEET had on corals, fish, crustaceans etc
Thank you

Roatan Marine Park

Promoting Research, Conservation and Education on Roatan



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Jessica Carilli to West, coral-list
show details May 15 (4 days ago)

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Surely if you dump DEET into a tank with a coral in it, bad things will
happen, but I wonder, in the grand scheme of impacts on the reef,
whether DEET washing off divers is actually a big impact?
After contracting dengue fever in Utila, Honduras, I've taken to
wearing concentrated DEET (and long sleeved clothes) in tropical
locations where dengue is epidemic. In this situation, I feel like the
relative dangers of NOT wearing DEET to human health may outweigh the
impact on the reef, which I am assuming is relatively minor. I might
well be wrong though, and will be interested to see other responses to
this post.
One idea would be to encourage DEET use on land but to suggest people
wash just before suiting up to get in the water. However, if the
wastewater is not treated it would eventually just be flushed out to
the reef anyways...
Jessica Carilli
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John Ware to West, coral-list
show details 09:26 (23 hours ago)

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Dear List,

Am I the only one who finds it curious that a Marine Park imposed a ban
on something without having a basis for that ban?? Is this DEET issue
anything like the lead weight issue? (You may recall that, about a year
or 2 ago at least one marine park was considering a ban on uncoated lead
weights because of fear of lead dissolving in the ocean.)

I fear that marine park rules with little or no scientific basis will
possibly lead to a public perception that all rules are frivolous.

John Ware

West End Sandy Bay Marine Park wrote:

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* SeaServices, Inc. *
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Needless to say, I agree with both opinions.

 

[mrlipis]

The Roatan Marine Park has always informed its visitors that they should not wear DEET and then enter the sea as it proves to be toxic and damaging for the reef and its inhabitants.
We are now being questioned and would like to provide people with scientific evidence to back our claims. Please provide us with links high lighting the detrimental effects that DEET had on corals, fish, crustaceans etc
Thank you

Roatan Marine Park

I am very confused about this post from RTBmediver. Please clarify. Are you part of the Marine park? Are you asking us to send you high lighted data on Deet? Where did those posts come? from?

 

[RTBDiver]

I must agree with the previous poster, It seems like the RMP is now asking for someone for information that could back up thier reasonings for being against deet without having any information themselves. Notice they also do not give any info on the products the reccomend.

 

[RTBDiver]

While they may actually be a very good product I wouls also suggest everyone that reads this to email the Cactus Juice company and ask them how their ALL Natural product has gotten so well known and lists Octisalate, Oxybenzone , Octinoxate in its ingredients? Where are these ingredients found in Nature?
Here is their contact info

For Internet Telephone Orders:
Telephone Toll Free: 877-554-5222

Corporate Headquarters:
Safe Solutions, Inc.
2601 Ridgemar Plaza, Suite 205
Fort Worth, Texas 76121
Toll-Free 877-554-5222
Fax 817-886-4781

Special Forms

 

[Doc]

I am very confused about this post from RTBmediver. Please clarify. Are you part of the Marine park? Are you asking us to send you high lighted data on Deet? Where did those posts come? from?

All of your questions were answered in his post. It just takes some dissection.

Shown were three copied posts from a message board group called Coral-List.

The first post was from RMP asking list members to contribute information as to any scientific studies regarding the impact of DEET. There were two replies (so far).

RTBmeDiver (aka: Doc Radawski) has been involved in diving on Roatan since the early 70's and is extremely well versed in environmental issues with intimate involvement on a cellular level.

I think the last line was his own comment of agreement.

When RTBmeDiver speaks, it is well advised to listen. Doc of the Bay

Who's still swimming on this list? Two Legged Creatures of the Bay Islands I believe one of the few is Doc Radawski, alias RTBmeDiver.

 

[Ayisha]

Your post from Canadian Health also mention "extended periods of time" Can you perhapse post the link that may expalin what this extended period of time is?
Also, do these Canadian studies have any option that is known to work as good and proven to be any safer?
Thanls

There was information in one of the links that led me to that Health Canada document above that mentioned that the re-evaluation was based on studies by the University of Alberta, but I did not find any links to those studies. Perhaps you can find those studies.

Picaridin is not yet approved for use in Canada, although it is prevalant in the U.S. and Europe. My personal experience with Picaridin in the form of Cutter's Advanced in Roatan is excellent - highly effective, no smell, no "yucky" feeling on the skin, did not take my nailpolish off - a thumbs up from our party of 14 in Roatan a few months ago. Lack of bites while wearing Cutter's and getting bitten when we forgot - pretty logical conclusions by us on a small, personal scale.

The CDC has approved and recognized Picaridin as being an effective alternative to DEET, so that should answer your last question above.

 

[RTBDiver]

The CDC has approved and recognized Picaridin as being an effective alternative to DEET, so that should answer your last question above.

Actually it is the EPA that I am also concerned with as DEET has been tested and approved and recomended by the CDC and the EPA tells us Picaridin is moderately toxic while finding DEET only slightly toxic so I am not sure of the point of your post. I am sure there are many options more toxic than deet available but what I was looking for were options known to be as effective and safer for the environment

 

[mrlipis]

All of your questions were answered in his post. It just takes some dissection.

I think I was able to dissect his post and obviously came to the same conclusions as you, but wanted it clarified before I made my next statement.

How the hell does anyone make a claim that something is harmful and then proceed to ask for help in supporting that claim. I'm sorry and no disrespect to Doc, but this is an irresponsible approach to any management process.

The health of our reef is being compromised by two things. Run off and anchors. As an earlier poster has mentioned, what good does it do to wash said chemicals off our bodies if they just end up back in the ocean via run off.