Deco Bottle Mounting

[DevonDiver]

Meh, there's a certain amount of great divers out there that use them without any problem AFAIK....
In other words: it's the diver, not the gear.

Yeah, it looks slick when the tanks are positive and floating up under the primaries.

They're not so slick when they're negative and hanging down.

#howtotakepromophotos
#depletingcylindersformarketingpurposes

Not to say that you cannot rig a 'normal' deco to behave itself when slung with sidemount... but you need to get your attachments set millimetre-perfect.

With sidemount, at least, you have front and rear (or sliding) attachment points on the waist. With backmount, you only have a single waist attachment location - usually centre-side of the torso.... and, as mentioned, you rig your shoulder D-rings higher.

 

[Patoux01]

Yeah, it looks slick when the tanks are positive and floating up under the primaries.

They're not so slick when they're negative and hanging down.

Are you suggesting that Santiago is a liar? Same goes for Widmann as AFAIK he uses that technique?

 

[MyronGanes]

Firstly.... Sidemount is different to backmount.

That's why you can't enjoy great results using backmount deco configuration.

Rob Neto described a good way of rigging sidemount stages, that's caught on asa deco configuration also.

Bottom band holds a 4-6" 8mm bungee loop to a bolt-snap. Top bolt-snap is held on the cylinder neck with a tight bungee choker. Shoulder D-rings should be higher than backmount.. just below the clavicle. No need for rope/handle along the stage/deco. Bottom bolt-snap connects to the rear waist attachment.

The elasticity keeps the deco/stage tight up against the body and streamlined with the primary cylinders.

There's a technique for best donning/doffing the cylinders. Otherwise people can struggle with the bolt snaps. Use the right technique and it's easy.

Are there any pictures of this setup online somewhere?

So now as to adress OP's problem, I'd say there's other issues before trying to mount a stage on that configuration IMO (weighted flopping tanks), but anyway. That top boltsnap seems to be very far away from the tank. How is the bottom of the tank attached? Do you have 2 d-rings or only 1?


Find someone that knows how to do it, even a 1-day training session with a decent instructor will save you tons of issues in the long run.

I have two D-rings on the shoulder but it doesn't really make a difference which one I attach it to. I have one D ring on the waist which I just clip the bottom boltsnap to. I've initially tried diving aluminums without weights and attaching them to lower attachment points but it didn't work out for me back then. I could give it another try but teaching myself sidemount is a hell of a lot of trial and error. It's hard to find sidemount instructors where I am who agree with my schedule.

 

[Patoux01]

I actually meant D-rings on the waist. With aluminium tanks, you'll either need 2 D-rings (per side) on the waist, or a sliding ring. This way you can move the tank around as it goes from negative to positive, allowing for a much tighter "fit".

Imo, get the primaries right before adding a stage.

 

[Aotus]

An instructor is indispensable. Even a sort of crumby one (a lot more common) will be able to give you instant feedback when you're in the water.

That said, I switched to a new system recently and spent a few hours in a pool with a camera, film, watch, adjust, repeat, and it worked out fine. But, I already knew the concepts and had the experience to know what is right and what is terrible, and knew ways to fix it. No shame in going through "terrible", that's what pool days are for.

PSAI makes a very good sidemount manual that you might read to get some of the concepts down to speed up the learning. I don't know what PADI's manual looks like, but judging by the images they use to advertise the course, I would stay FAR away. There may be other manuals, but at least one that I know of was written by someone who learned SM from the person who wrote the PSAI manual, and so I would recommend going to the original source.

 

[Aotus]

Are you suggesting that Santiago is a liar? Same goes for Widmann as AFAIK he uses that technique?

Clearly they're photoshopped. When I was diving with Patrick, I swear I could see the brush strokes in the water around him

 

[DevonDiver]

Are you suggesting that Santiago is a liar? Same goes for Widmann as AFAIK he uses that technique?

Of course not.

But it's relatively common to ensure neutral stage/deco for optimal image when shooting publicity shots.

That those cylinders are slightly buoyant is quite evident from the photos you shared. Don't you see that?

Obviously, savvy dive pros don't select less than optimal photographs for marketing purposes.

I also use 'conventional' deco rigging on many dives... because all I'm doing is shuttling them directly to a primary tip-off where they're left. No need for optimal rigging under those circumstances. But that doesn't mean a well trained diver should tolerate swinging, unstable deco/stages either.

Practicality versus being photogenic. LOL

 

[DevonDiver]

Are there any pictures of this setup online somewhere?

I'm planning an article, but I need to get some in-water shots also. Don't get many shots of myself, because I'm busy teaching mostly.

I actually meant D-rings on the waist. With aluminium tanks, you'll either need 2 D-rings (per side) on the waist, or a sliding ring. This way you can move the tank around as it goes from negative to positive, allowing for a much tighter "fit".

Imo, get the primaries right before adding a stage.

With sliding D-rings you'll get the primaries right, then face issues with deco/stages. Lowering the sliding D-ring then drops stages/deco too low. You'd still need an additional lower attachment point for those...

That's the reason why I stick with fixed D-rings.

Also... many sliding D-rings get a little mobile when challenged by 3+ AL80s pulling on them.

That said, I've not tried the sliding D-rings that Santiago and SumpUK manufacture.

 

[Aotus]

Of course not.

But it's relatively common to ensure neutral stage/deco for optimal image when shooting publicity shots.

That those cylinders are slightly buoyant is quite evident from the photos you shared. Don't you see that?

Obviously, savvy dive pros don't select less than optimal photographs for marketing purposes.

I also use 'conventional' deco rigging on many dives... because all I'm doing is shuttling them directly to a primary tip-off where they're left. No need for optimal rigging under those circumstances. But that doesn't mean a well trained diver should tolerate swinging, unstable deco/stages either.

Practicality versus being photogenic. LOL

these look like pretty full tanks to me:

 

[DevonDiver]

these look like pretty full tanks to me:

Which shows my point.

Its not perfect.... it's a realistic...and it's good.

The method I described holds the cylinders tighter, trimmer.... but it's a hassle depending on the parameters of the dive (as I described).... like in the video, where swift staging of cylinders is desirable.