Dangerous Crossing

[cvchief]

Well, Ron, things reported as FACT in Por Esto are really more like probable aren't they? Our highly likely is more like fact that their fact right?. (I mean it is Por Esto! I love to read it, but I don't always believe it.)

As to the sinking, I read here she went down by the stern and then swamped. The other story is a hull failure. The stories didn't seem mutually exclusive.

 

[cvchief]

FACT: i have been aware in the past, that there are only a certain amount of park permits given out and that when a boat is retired or out of commission it is common practice for the permit to pass on to another boat but that name of the permit has to stay the same. i can't even begin to speculate on this one.

Jen,

I agree with alot you have said about the garbage, but are you quite sure that it is a fact that the name on the boat must stay the same? I could tick off a few boats with personalized names that aren't that old, which lead me to believe you can change the name, since they would have to have been transfer permits. I am certainly not sure of this, but I think I am correct. Maybe Dave would weight in on this? I think he has bought and sold a boat or two.

 

[DandyDon]

Yeah, I doubt that Mexican journalism is much more factual than US news, which we knows sucks.

Thanks Jen...!

FACT: i have been aware in the past, that there are only a certain amount of park permits given out and that when a boat is retired or out of commission it is common practice for the permit to pass on to another boat but that name of the permit has to stay the same. i can't even begin to speculate on this one.

I see some reasons for such limits, but there is a down side to it. Not that I have a better idea...

 

[Texas Torpedo]

It is dated Jan 6, looks exactly like the boat they were fixing, has the same brand new motor, same picture and letters on the side, and the bottom looks like it is squared down the side indicating what would look like a modified or glass bottom.

The vast majority of boats in Cozumel use the same or similar Yamaha motors... Just like the one in the video, though I wasn't able to tell if it was brand new or otherwise, and I doubt you were able to either. Outside of that, you really can't tell much of anything from that video.. The variety of custom modified pangas in Coz are wide ranging, especially after retrofits and restorations by new owners with specific customizations in mind. I know nothing about the boat that went down.. Just stating what I have seen..

BTW it has nothing to do with quickly convicting anyone, the investigation is obviously confused as to exactly what vessel went down. That not only shows them but gives brief views of the bottom and a brief view of the area where the registration number is. It is very bright with sunlight but I am sure it could be edited to show the numbers.

The (real) "investigation" taking place in Cozumel is likely a whole lot less "confused" as the one being conducted in this thread and possibly elsewhere online. While you, me and the majority of others speculate and pontificate, I'm fairly sure the powers that be on the island are well aware of exactly which boat was registered, which boat is now sunk, and who all is involved, their roles, etc. While this may break a few hearts, I have a gut feeling no Mexican officials will be showing up here (or anywhere else online) to give us their findings.. I'm glad ScubaDoc shared what she did.. I don't expect anything more, nor do I feel entitled to it...

Despite the events that lead to Mau's boat going down and 8 or 9 divers and crew floating for hours, I feel there is good that will come out of this, just as I feel there are positives many took away from Brendan's death late last year, which has opened many eyes to the reality of CO poisoning, and testing for not only 02 but CO to prevent gas related injuries and death. Personally, I won't dive off-shore any longer without carrying a personal locator such as the Nautilus Lifeline, McMurdo Fastfind, SPOT locator, etc, just as I will not breath air from any tank until I test if for both CO & 02 content. They are a small price to pay for your life.. If you can afford a dive trip, you owe it to yourselves to afford these devices first.. OR, you can keep rolling the dice..

Cozumel is an exceptionally safe place to dive, just like the FL keys, Bonaire, Roatan, Fiji and hundreds of other dive destinations, but "at the end of the day", and especially before you splash, every diver is responsible for their own safety... Ask questions and equip yourself accordingly..

 

[ggunn]

I don't know a lot about boats, but I am finding all the boats in question to be a bit different from each other.

1st photo - I'm trying to compare the Nora Gabriela (photo shot in 2011) to the Livingunderwater boat on Mau's FB page and they look quite different. The Nora Gabriela was in operation last summer (I shot this photo from La Hach) so I'm a bit confused as to why it was put to rest and appeared as the Livingunderwater.

2nd photo - Then I'm trying to compare the the Aldora II to the boat photo on Mau's FB page and they also look quite different. I'm really confused about the boats! Someone help me out here.

FWIW, the two boats in your first panel look like the same boat to me.

 

[WSOPFAN]

I am just dumbfounded and astonished by the fact that some people repeatedly come here and sugar coat things like a dive shop owner being dead and another probably permanently paralyzed. Couple that with the fact that now that members of that same dive shop, no matter if it's past or present, Nearly kill 9 divers with their negligence and yet again laughing as if it were nothing or working so feverishly to downplay it. If anyone who reads here wanted an explanation of why me or others can get so insanely infuriated with stories like these, you just got your answer. As far as the news articles, the article from today seems like they did alot of investigating to come up with those answers. Of course once again everything in the Mexican news is all lies right?

 

[cvchief]

I am just dumbfounded and astonished by the fact that some people repeatedly come here and sugar coat things like a dive shop owner being dead and another probably permanently paralyzed. Couple that with the fact that now that members of that same dive shop, no matter if it's past or present, Nearly kill 9 divers with their negligence and yet again laughing as if it were nothing or working so feverishly to downplay it. If anyone who reads here wanted an explanation of why me or others can get so insanely infuriated with stories like these, you just got your answer. As far as the news articles, the article from today seems like they did alot of investigating to come up with those answers. Of course once again everything in the Mexican news is all lies right?

You are going overboard again. When would the responsibility stop? Is Mau still responsible for something that Opal's Dream might do tomorrow? I personally have never been in the situation but have observed many soon to be ex-spouses. Most people in the process of divorce have limited influence on each other. Why do you need to connect Opal's incident with Mau? Doesn't Mau seem to have enough explaining to do without have to explain what his ex did?

 

[TSandM]

Not to get into the middle of the arguments here, but as a novice boat owner, I have had to do some studying on boat safety. One of the things that was emphasized was the danger of running a boat in conditions where one would be likely to take a large wave over the stern. Apparently that's a very fast way to sink a boat. So maybe there wasn't any need for any structural failure for this to happen.

 

[ggunn]

I am just dumbfounded and astonished by the fact that some people repeatedly come here and sugar coat things like a dive shop owner being dead and another probably permanently paralyzed. Couple that with the fact that now that members of that same dive shop, no matter if it's past or present, Nearly kill 9 divers with their negligence and yet again laughing as if it were nothing or working so feverishly to downplay it. If anyone who reads here wanted an explanation of why me or others can get so insanely infuriated with stories like these, you just got your answer. As far as the news articles, the article from today seems like they did alot of investigating to come up with those answers. Of course once again everything in the Mexican news is all lies right?

Why do you keep insisting that it was the same dive op? Mau split from Scuba Mau and started his own op months before Opal and Gabi's incident. The fact that Opal's shop was still being called Scuba Mau at the time is irrelevant; Mau himself was long gone.

I am not sugarcoating anything. Opal, Gabi, and Heath took upon themselves what was IMO a crazy extreme amount of risk and paid dearly for it. Mau had nothing to do with it. If (IF, and I don't know, either) Mau sent an unseaworthy boat out across the channel, that's an unacceptable amount of risk as well, but I don't think it's connected in any sort of significant way to the other incident other than that all the parties know/knew each other.

 

[Mike]

Not to get into the middle of the arguments here, but as a novice boat owner, I have had to do some studying on boat safety. One of the things that was emphasized was the danger of running a boat in conditions where one would be likely to take a large wave over the stern. Apparently that's a very fast way to sink a boat. So maybe there wasn't any need for any structural failure for this to happen.

A following sea is a dangerous thing you have to be aware of, but unless new information confirms otherwise - There was no large wave over the stern, this was covered a bunch of posts back.

According to the Mexican news agencies (more than one so far, but maybe they are just regurgitating the same initial reporting?) one of the persons on the boat reported the boat 'coming apart', the media reported more than once a glass bottom 'shattering' as in breaking apart. Taking that into account and trying to piece it together leads one to believe the boat either had a glass bottom viewing section that was either completely removed and repaired and ended up breaking up and sinking the boat, or the boat still had the glass bottom viewing section and it was possibly 'repaired' in some sort of way from the inside and 'covered' in some way? Probably from the inside and decking covered back over, and that broke up and caused the sinking. More than one account including Jenlove2dive has stated they have been on the boat and there was no evidence to the naked eye to indicated to anyone there was anything different about the boat in question, so it leads one to believe whatever they had at one time was covered over and not easily recognizable as anything out of the ordinary. (I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt that at least some shoddy repair to the glass bottom section was made and it failed, it's hard to imagine somebody just covering it over, but who the heck knows?

As said, more than one news source has reported some sort of structural failure of the hull, connected in some way to a glass bottom section failing. One specifically talked about air being trapped under it and being pounded by the boat motion through the seas causing it to break and sink the boat.

All reports so far seem to agree the boat went down rapidly, something like 15 seconds.

One thing for sure, swamped boats from over the stern waves don't sink like a rock, one that has experienced instantaneous loss of displacement do. You open up a 10 square foot or larger hole in the bottom of the hull and displacement has vanished and that boat is going down quickly.