Cozumel Incident 9/4/11

[DandyDon]

In an effort to waste more rescue and recovery resources.

He's a movie stuntmen. They rewrite rules. My guessing is often wrong tho.

 

[WSOPFAN]

This post will sound sarcastic but there are too many asking how "professional" divers could get in this situation: my question to you is have you ever exceeded a speed limit, was the view any better going faster, do you or did you ever have a radar detector? Why? Is it dangerous to surpass the speed limit? OK, I'm done.

No I am not. The last thing I will say is I would miss so much in life if I were to judge others by one act or observation, be it factual or not. These people are obviously loved because they DID follow and preach "speed limits", as it related to their profession.

These people are hurting and my heart goes out to them, I really don't care how
They got to this spot, they have my support!

Not sure if you have kids but let me ask you this....you have a child that is introduced to heroin.....do you blame your child or do you blame the person that gave it to them...?? I know a woman who is sitting by her daughter who can't move or feel anything below her neck. When the so called heroism and sympathy wears off where are people going to point the finger?

 

[makochum]

What condition are they in now?

 

[WSOPFAN]

What condition are they in now?

See post # 382 on this thread......

 

[boulderjohn]

This post will sound sarcastic but there are too many asking how "professional" divers could get in this situation: my question to you is have you ever exceeded a speed limit, was the view any better going faster, do you or did you ever have a radar detector? Why? Is it dangerous to surpass the speed limit? OK, I'm done.

You write as if there are only 2 conditions--observing the speed limit perfectly and speeding. In my neck of the woods I would guess that 80% of the drivers go roughly 5 mph over the speed limit on the freeway. Is that the same as going 130 mph on a narrow, windy, country road?

 

[WSOPFAN]

Originally Posted by H2ODoc View Post
I hate to ask this question, but for someone that's experienced this type of DCS, can they ever dive again?

Two out of three hope to walk again, and I'm doubtful on one of those.

The one who is walking, who did not chase the deep diver - might get cleared to dive. I've dived with him some and I suspect he will, cleared or not.

He said can they dive again...as in medically........He didn't ask if they could walk........

 

[WSOPFAN]

Also maybe getting cleared to dive is NOT a medical definition of if they can dive again based on the level of DCS they had.

 

[nauticab]

I hate to ask this question, but for someone that's experienced this type of DCS, can they ever dive again?

hi i am nauticab (who has been quoted here from another forum several times). i live in cozumel, worked as a DM for 6 years and now own a fishing store frequented by DMs and captains so i, like a few others here, are in constant contact with them and know the situation well.
gabi is a friend, opal is a good acquaintance, and heath i met after the fact in the hospital. i visited gabi the other day and i asked him about his future diving. one doc said possibly in 2 years if he has 100% recovery. however, a 2nd doctor told him it will be best to NEVER dive again since he was bent before (not sure of the extent or type or symptoms)....since if he dove again, he would be playing with his life. he personally told me he is choosing to stick with doc #2 and has hung up his scuba gear for good. he has a family and i am sure this has been a serious, tragic, wakeup call for the future of his kids.

i will likely not post often on this forum but i would like to mention my point of view as to possible lessons learned other than obvious (lack of planning, redundant air, etc).

with regards to captains and their role (something not discussed here...what was the capt doing? and why did he allow a IWR dive?):
more training for the captains as to signs of DCS.
giving the captains the AUTHORITY OVER THE DM for redundancy of equipment if a planned deep dive, with a tank hanging at 60', etc etc. (i now of dive ops that have a tank or 2 hanging at 60' whenever there is a punta sur dive).
also giving the capt auth OVER THE DM to tell them NO for an in water recompression and insist on chamber treatment (or at least evaluation) immediately. it shouldn't matter if it was the boss wanting to do it.

and regarding downcurrents:
1. watch your bubbles. if they start going down, there is a down current.
2. watch the sand chutes on the wall. ditto above.
3. watch the fish. a strong downcurrent will make the small fish swim and hide in the little crevices.
4. if you are on a deep dive (100+), and feel a downcurrent, get as close to the wall as possible (this is when you can ignore the 1 meter space rule between you and the wall) and gently kick vertically to ascend.
5. if you are on a strong downcurrent, grab the corals if you have to and crawl up if #4 does not work.
6. NEVER PANIC. stay with your buddy and communicate.

just my $.02

 

[Crush]

These people are hurting and my heart goes out to them, I really don't care how
They got to this spot, they have my support!

As does mine. I wish them a speedy and complete recovery.

This post will sound sarcastic but there are too many asking how "professional" divers could get in this situation: my question to you is have you ever exceeded a speed limit, was the view any better going faster, do you or did you ever have a radar detector? Why? Is it dangerous to surpass the speed limit?

They were not professionals at diving deep - they were amateurs. They may have been DMs or instructors, but they were little kids compared to trained technical divers - children, pretending to be adults. They gambled, they lost, and the sad thing is that they did not realize how stupid they were being until after-the-fact.

Your parallel with speeding is a poorly-contrived attempt to elicit sympathy from a broad audience. Why did you choose the analogy of speeding? It seems to me that drunk driving would be a more appropriate parallel - lets dive to 250 feet on air and then see who is sober enough to remember that we agreed to stop at 250. Oops! One of us forgot to stop! This is an accident by misadventure in which the outcome was not a desired outcome, but it was entirely predictable.

By the way - welcome to ScubaBoard - I hope that you have had a pleasant few days since you joined. I am not normally this poorly-tempered, but I am easily agitated by well-intentioned souls who act as apologists for those who should have know better.

 

[Kymcobob]

Boulder john, they are the same UNLESS you get caught, either by the police of by motor nature. I agree that danger is more likely doing 130 on windy roads, but do YOU stop driving or using those street when you hear someone else did that? My point is that I suspect many of the posters on the forum have done some beyond the limits kind of things in their life including diving. I know I certainly dive more conservatively now than I did the first few years after being certified. When I first started riding motorcycles, I would often ride in shorts and a t-shirt. I wouldn't dream of leaving my driveway now without ATGATT (all the gear, all the time). That came with age and I suspect a few encounters to realize I am not immortal.
I just don't understand how anyone can come to a conclusion that Cozumel is inherently dangerous from hearing about this incident. I also hear about how this and Wilma is ruining Cozumel as a dive/tourist destination. Bull HONKY! poor marketing is Hurting Cozumel. Pick up any dive magazine and read about Belize, Caymen, Paulau. Articles everywhere! Cozumel, not so much. Travel magazines don't even carry articles. I believe the tourism board has relied so heavily on cruise business that the hotels, dive shops and others in retail are getting the short end. I am not complaining, as a diver I can still find great deals. What is upsetting is seeing the airlines cutting back on the number of flights. That does affect me and I would guess all of you who may live there. Alright, I hear myself rambling.