Choice nuggets from the LDS

[Scuba_Vixen]

another week of it and I'll be singin' a different tune though. I'm glad it turned out OK. I have a real issue with trusting gear once it's been abused or damaged in some ways.......if that had been one of my doubles sets, I'd never dive it deep again..if at all. Fortunately, my LDS lets me control my fills, so I'm safe from all but myself.

I can live with that,

Darlene

 

[COVCI]

and missed this post...

Darlene,

I completely agree that the cylinder should have been hydrostatically retested. But...remember that an aluminum cylinder can have a hole in the crown or sidewall and still pass the hydro retest.

As a PSI inspector, I would have had the cylinder hydro retested and then visually inspected based upon the known history. For good measure, I would have then used Eddy Current technology (note: one should be properly trained and have sufficient experience with EC use with alloys other than 6351) to ensure the integrity of the cylinder.

Aluminum cylinder manufacturers indicate that cylinders have an expected life of over 100,000 fills to working pressure or 10,000 fills to hydro retest pressure.

While the practice of filling an AL 80 to 4000 psig is not the smartest thing in the world, it will not in itself render the cylinder as unusable.

ALL of my cylinders have the fill pressure and my name written across the crown of the cylinders in indelible black marker. This is a reminder for all of the Fill Station Operators.

When asked how much I want in the cylinders, I point to the crown and state the working pressure.

If filling to working pressure using manufacturer guidelines (300-600 psig/min), I can fill an AL80 to 3000 in a little over 10 minutes and have no appreciable loss of pressure later. The cylinder is not hot to the touch.

So...my recommendation is "When in doubt...check it out!"

Chris
COVCI

 

[MikeFerrara]

Hooked4Life once bubbled...
LDS's just never cease to amaze me. My Girlfriend and I bought a PADI AOW book to study for our AOW classes. We went into our LDS to sign up for classes that weekend. My LDS explained that its not worth the time or money to train us in AOW because they make no money from the classes and we did not buy our "life support" from them. This was the same LDS that sold us the PADI AOW book, $800 worth of Faber tanks (1 month ago) and my GF was OW certified through them. They also turned my other Dive Buddy away and told him the same thing. I walked out in amazement. I guess that explains the Porsche Boxter, Harley, and full size GMC in the parking lot.

It might sound crazy but that's the way it is. Classes are mostly a loss leader used to sell equipment. With equipment being sold so cheap on-line and class prices as low as they are it doesn't make much sense to teach a class to some one who has just baught all their equipment. If the shop had other people in the class it'd make sense to have you in the class but to teach a small class of folks who already spent the big money somewhere else is just a loss. True you might buy something some day but it's hard to keep investing time and money into people with no return. BTW, markups on tanks, especially the expensive steel tanks, stinks

Folks, with what a job behind the counter in a shop pays, you can't expect to get some one who knows anything.

I just talked to a well known shop in Florida who is looking for instructors who will also work in the shop. Currently none of the folks in the shop are even divers. As much as I'd love to move there I won't teach the short quicky classes they offer and I made more money when I was 16 working in McDonalds. They will, however find some one. How good do you think they'll be?

Also, for the person who didn't want the yellow deco bottle...distributors don't sell meny al40's and often only carry them in one color. If there is a color selection it will be shown in the catalog. I'm not saying thay're not made in other colors but all of the al40's and smaller we have are yellow and there aren't any other options from the distributors we buy from.

Threads like this are funny.

 

[jrg]

Hooked4Life once bubbled...
LDS's just never cease to amaze me. My Girlfriend and I bought a PADI AOW book to study for our AOW classes. We went into our LDS to sign up for classes that weekend. My LDS explained that its not worth the time or money to train us in AOW because they make no money from the classes and we did not buy our "life support" from them. This was the same LDS that sold us the PADI AOW book, $800 worth of Faber tanks (1 month ago) and my GF was OW certified through them. They also turned my other Dive Buddy away and told him the same thing. I walked out in amazement. I guess that explains the Porsche Boxter, Harley, and full size GMC in the parking lot.

Did they advertise the class (signs/prices posted in the store or on a website)? If they did then they shouldn't turn people away. That's just BS.

 

[cornfed]

MikeFerrara once bubbled...

I just talked to a well known shop in Florida who is looking for instructors who will also work in the shop. Currently none of the folks in the shop are even divers. As much as I'd love to move there I won't teach the short quicky classes they offer and I made more money when I was 16 working in McDonalds. They will, however find some one. How good do you think they'll be?

Stop complaining. FL has to many dive shops already. Move to Maryland and setup your own shop. Trust me we could use a good one.

I'll help you pack the u-haul.

Threads like this are funny.

Why? Because people keep blowing the dust off and refusing to let them die?

 

[MikeFerrara]

jrg once bubbled...


Did they advertise the class (signs/prices posted in the store or on a website)? If they did then they shouldn't turn people away. That's just BS.

Lots of shops advertise a class and when and if enough people sign up and it becomes worthwhile they do it. A shop isn't under any obligation to provide you anything unless you already paid for it.

I think that if they were going to make money doing it they would have done it. It sounds to me like they were being honest. They could have just said they were booked up or something.
Some of you seem to think a shop is getting something when divers only go there for the loss leader stuff. With luck the shops will wise up and make everything they provide a profit center and the model will make sense. You'll get gear cheap but a class will cost a small fortune. Right now you get cheap gear and cheap classes. That won't last.

 

[MikeFerrara]

cornfed once bubbled...


Stop complaining. FL has to many dive shops already. Move to Maryland and setup your own shop. Trust me we could use a good one.

I'll help you pack the u-haul.

LOL. No, I think I've had my fill of it. Now, I mostly just want to dive.

Why? Because people keep blowing the dust off and refusing to let them die?

No, because the shops are still willing to provide the loss leaders and sit around being mad at every one who wants those and nothing else. Well, that and the fact that most divers don't have a clue what's going on.

 

[jrg]

MikeFerrara once bubbled...


Lots of shops advertise a class and when and if enough people sign up and it becomes worthwhile they do it. A shop isn't under any obligation to provide you anything unless you already paid for it.......

Be that as it may, it's still BS to tell customers the reason they can't be trained is that they already have their own equipment. If the LDS told me that I'd probably post it on here, too.

 

[cornfed]

Well, that and the fact that most divers don't have a clue what's going on.

That's why I like you, you're helping the rest of us get a clue.

You'd love the shop closest to me!

 

[MikeFerrara]

jrg once bubbled...


Be that as it may, it's still BS to tell customers the reason they can't be trained is that they already have their own equipment. If the LDS told me that I'd probably post it on here, too.

Just because you don't like it doesn't make it BS. This is what the current dive industry is. If you buy all your equipment someplace else a shop has no reason to want you as a student unless they just need an extry person to round out the class or something. Add in the fact that you might talk about all the online deals you've found and you become a real liability to the shop. The numbers are simple.

Things are changing. It used to be that most divers got their equipment from the shop so if a student came in once in a while who already had it there wasn't an issue. Now a significant number of divers are buying online. I don't blame them but that does make it very unattractive to run a class for them at the current prices.