Cavern with single tank?

[Manatee Diver]

I'm a little surprised there's so much support here for the idea of doing cavern in a single tank; I guess if I'd had to place a bet, I would've bet on this board leaning the other way. I'd be curious to hear more about people's reasons.

Under the new NSS standards cavern diving is single tank only. They feel that allowing doubles or sidemount for cavern divers creates an environment where it is too tempting to exceed your level of certification.

 

[fxb]

Under the new NSS standards cavern diving is single tank only. They feel that allowing doubles or sidemount for cavern divers creates an environment where it is too tempting to exceed your level of certification.

This is very interesting, thank you for sharing. It makes a lot of sense.

 

[Marie13]

My OW/Advanced instructors took cavern in a single tank with Bill Ostreich (sp?) of Bird’s Underwater in FL a few years back. They didn’t know when they were going to be able to do cave classes (and still haven’t), so this allows them to do the FL caverns for the time being.

 

[uncfnp]

We did cavern in single tank recreational gear. My partner then (husband now) had zero interest in cave. And though I have progressed slightly further I have no regrets for taking cavern in recreational gear.

If recreational cavern is your buddy’s choice go for it. It is worthwhile course even on the recreational level and will make those guided cenote dives even more enjoyable.

 

[Lorenzoid]

I think I'm not alone when I say there really aren't many cavern zones in Florida that are substantial enough to hold my interest. You can go in and look around for a few minutes in a relatively featureless place and then you're done. There are very few divers who make a hobby out of cavern diving (though I can think of one on this board who claimed to for a while). Which, in addition to damping temptation to push limits, is another reason why I think some instructors and agencies lean toward treating cavern training more as a public safety course or a get-a-taste course--you get some hands-on education as to WHY you need more training to dive safely in overhead environments. As I understand it (not being an instructor or cave training history buff) Cavern was never intended to be an endpoint; it was supposed to be a temporary waypoint--the first course in a progression. I took Cavern in recreational gear, and the biggest takeaway from that course for me was that this training wasn't going to be sufficient for me, given my low personal risk tolerance, to explore caverns, let alone anything beyond that.

 

[MrBigfins]

I think I'm not alone when I say there really aren't many cavern zones in Florida that are substantial enough to hold my interest. You can go in and look around for a few minutes in a relatively featureless place and then you're done. There are very few divers who make a hobby out of cavern diving (though I can think of one on this board who claimed to for a while). Which, in addition to damping temptation to push limits, is another reason why I think some instructors and agencies lean toward treating cavern training more as a public safety course or a get-a-taste course--you get some hands-on education as to WHY you need more training to dive safely in overhead environments. As I understand it (not being an instructor or cave training history buff) Cavern was never intended to be an endpoint; it was supposed to be a temporary waypoint--the first course in a progression. I took Cavern in recreational gear, and the biggest takeaway from that course for me was that this training wasn't going to be sufficient for me, given my low personal risk tolerance, to explore caverns, let alone anything beyond that.

For me cavern was a phenomenal class. It pushed me outside my comfort zone, introduced task loading (as strictly an ocean and quarry diver my previous tasks included look at the pretty fish) improved my kick techniques, improved my proficiency with Bouyancy, intro to reel and line work, and it made me realize that although I was excited to move into cave diving I wasn't ready to yet. So I feel there is a place for recreational level cavern dives, and that the course made me a better diver all around. True most cavern zones in Florida aren't all that large or impressive, there are places to have alot of fun with it. Paradise being one of my favorites there.

 

[MrBigfins]

There is no such thing. Using DSD -- which already has a defined meaning -- to denigrate the cavern dives you dislike, is demeaning to both DSDs and to the cavern dives.

Officially it is not a thing, but that is essentially what happens only in an environment that is even more dangerous. Too many resorts and shops offer DSD with too little instruction and too many students to people it who have no real comprehension of how dangerous it is or an inkling of what those dangers are. PADI noting that DSD is the section that reports the most incidents and accidents is proof of that.

Guided cenote dives do the same thing, they take divers who are not adequately informed of the dangers presented by overhead environments and say trust me to get you through this. I'm dumbfounded by the amount of support that these types of dives get from the same people who scream TRAINING TRAINING TRAINING. How a certified cave diver can condone allowing an inexperienced and untrained diver into the situations the guided cenote dives allow is beyond me.

 

[tbone1004]

Not going to jump into the fray myself; I think both sides make good points. But I don't mind the discussion on the wisdom of guided cavern dives for OW divers. I think it's relevant to the general subject matter, plus it bumps the thread so more people see it and can give their input on my question.

I'm a little surprised there's so much support here for the idea of doing cavern in a single tank; I guess if I'd had to place a bet, I would've bet on this board leaning the other way. I'd be curious to hear more about people's reasons.

@Manatee Diver hit the nail on the head for me. Cavern to me, is a recreational specialty course. I.e. can and should be taken in recreational gear. It can be used by someone who is interested in doing limited wreck penetration, or just wants to feel safer in proper caverns but has no interest in going past the daylight zone. If you allow that course to be taken in doubles or sidemount, they're going to just want to go farther and farther. The new standards FINALLY acknowledged what many/most of the students were doing after class *violating their limits*, and adjusted the limits to be more in line with what people are going to do anyway.

 

[Lorenzoid]

For me cavern was a phenomenal class. It pushed me outside my comfort zone, introduced task loading (as strictly an ocean and quarry diver my previous tasks included look at the pretty fish) improved my kick techniques, improved my proficiency with Bouyancy, intro to reel and line work, and it made me realize that although I was excited to move into cave diving I wasn't ready to yet. So I feel there is a place for recreational level cavern dives, and that the course made me a better diver all around.

Yes, that's another reason some people take a Cavern course: to get some intro-to-tech type training if they don't already have that.

 

[tbone1004]

Yes, that's another reason some people take a Cavern course: to get some intro-to-tech type training if they don't already have that.

that's actually a good point as well. In Florida at least, if you try to take an "intro to tech" course with most of the cave instructors, they'll urge you strongly to change it to a cavern course instead. It lets them teach the ITT course in a cavern vs having to stay in proper open water, which is immensely restricting. It is certainly what I would do if I was teaching down there.