Buddy Dive - bad attitude?

[oly5050user]

While I agree that dive op and the customer should do their best to keep things civil and polite, I don't agree that the dive op should just provide any amount of lead without questioning unusual requirements. 24# of lead, even for a larger diver, is unusual in tropical waters. I used to be questioned regularly when I asked for 2# in tropical waters - I am a fairly large diver. I had no problem explaining that my plate was 5# and I appreciated their concern.

What has not been said is lets say dive operator supplies 24lbs to said person and there is an accident. Lawyer for deceased gets a dive pro stating that 24lbs for some one of the deceased size should never use 24lbs of lead, at most 12lbs in a 3mm suit in salt water. How do you , as the dive operator defend your self in suppling 2 x the amount of lead that should have been used?
I find poor breathing patterns,unnecessary movement to be major contributors to divers using excessive lead. Again I am 6' 170 lbs and old..10 to 12 works out fine. When in a dry suit using a very thick 400 gram DUI thinsulate undergarment in salt water I use 24 lbs. In fresh water it is 18lbs..Cannot fathom using 24 lb in a 3mm, way unsafe , as Irene at Buddy Dive was probably concerned about ..Can this person stay on surface with no air in the bcd and not have to kick or move to stay on surface? If he/she cannot then it is too much lead. What would happen if bcd failed? Got a hole in it or corrugated inflator hose broke off connection?
AND NO I do not work at Buddy Dive.

 

[tridacna]

Holy cow. From rudeness to obesity to legal issues. Amazing.

Repeat: This is not an issue about how much weight the diver requested. It's ALL about the attitude of the dive staff. The guy could have requested carbolic acid to rinse his mask for all I care. It's how the staff dealt with it that's the basis of this thread. As a guest, I have paid a lot of money for my annual vacation. I don't expect to be treated with indifference or rudeness.

WE DON'T CARE HOW MUCH WEIGHT HE ASKED FOR. THAT'S IRRELEVANT.

If you think that it's OK for service personnel to be obnoxious and unwelcoming to resort guests, that place is not going to survive long term.

 

[oly5050user]

Holy cow. From rudeness to obesity to legal issues. Amazing.

Repeat: This is not an issue about how much weight the diver requested. It's ALL about the attitude of the dive staff. The guy could have requested carbolic acid to rinse his mask for all I care. It's how the staff dealt with it that's the basis of this thread. As a guest, I have paid a lot of money for my annual vacation. I don't expect to be treated with indifference or rudeness.

WE DON'T CARE HOW MUCH WEIGHT HE ASKED FOR. THAT'S IRRELEVANT.

If you think that it's OK for service personnel to be obnoxious and unwelcoming to resort guests, that place is not going to survive long term.

Buddy Dive will celebrate their 32 year anniversary soon. They also expanded into live aboard boats,2 of them in the Galagapos islands. Buddy Dive also serves as dive operator for Carribean club and Bellevue apts on Bonaire.I don't think they are going anywhere soon. Again I do not think that they were intentionally rude. May have been misread. I believe it was more that they truly cared for the divers safety and not drowning from using too much lead.

 

[gcarter]

Buddy Dive will celebrate their 32 year anniversary soon. They also expanded into live aboard boats,2 of them in the Galagapos islands. Buddy Dive also serves as dive operator for Carribean club and Bellevue apts on Bonaire.I don't think they are going anywhere soon. Again I do not think that they were intentionally rude. May have been misread. I believe it was more that they truly cared for the divers safety and not drowning from using too much lead.

The OP was simply ASKING if this was a typical experience or an anomoly, whether something had changed - because the OP's experience had changed from previous visits. How long they have bneen there is not relevant. Their expansion is not relevant - unless it is causing stress that is affecting customer service.

It was a fair question, but the OP has been unfairly pilloried. It is highly unlikely that the issue is simply the OP, as the OP has had previous good experiences. Yet that seems to be the thrust of much of the commentary.

I for one don't get it.

EDIT:

And has already been said, I don't get this focus on the lead. It isn't the lead. It isn't the question. It is the attitude. And the attitude about the lead wasn't the only issue. It seems that posters are latching onto the lead as a perceived easy way to defend without even understanding what they are defending - a simple question, not a tirade, not an attack.

I don't get it.

 

[Mike]

While I agree that dive op and the customer should do their best to keep things civil and polite, I don't agree that the dive op should just provide any amount of lead without questioning unusual requirements. 24# of lead, even for a larger diver, is unusual in tropical waters.

Who cares if it's a lot. The person's a certified diver, it isn't a Disney ride where the random public just shows up, or somebody who's never been on a dive before. Give them the weights they want and move on, as a dive master is it really going to ruin your day if the guy is over-weighted?

What has not been said is lets say dive operator supplies 24lbs to said person and there is an accident. Lawyer for deceased gets a dive pro stating that 24lbs for some one of the deceased size should never use 24lbs of lead, at most 12lbs in a 3mm suit in salt water. How do you , as the dive operator defend your self in suppling 2 x the amount of lead that should have been used?

1) The diver showed us a C-card, he was certified and qualified and required to determine his own proper weighting. Every diver is required to determine his own weight requirements.
2) Every diver with a C-card has been certified that he knows how to drop his weights if he needs to.
3) Dive master was not there as an instructor, he was there as a guide to guide certified divers, to point out fish etc, certified divers are responsible for their own safety.

If you're in any service industry and you feel the need to draw a line in the sand against a customer for a non-safety issue, that's 100% based on your ego and nothing more. Feel free to do it, but be warned customers will vote with their dollars, they will report their experiences about you, and not just to their friends or family, but more likely online, and it will effect your income. If your ego is more important then anything else, then go for it, argue with divers about their weights. Why stop there? Why not scold the first diver who runs low on air? Why not point fingers and giggle at the over-weight divers on the boat, or the ones who are fair-skinned and show up white without a tan, argue with them about the amount of sun screen to use too.

 

[Mitchell Teeters]

I guess we should just be grateful that they exist for us to give our money to. And I apologize to those that agree with their attitude and business practices. I will punish myself by not visiting the establishment, nor will I hurt or insult similar businesses with similar attitudes. Again, I apologize.

 

[tridacna]

Again I do not think that they were intentionally rude. May have been misread.

Oly, I know that you are not a sockpuppet for BD. How do you KNOW with such certainty what went on? Are you calling the OP a liar?

Appropriate response from BD should be: "We apologize for the rude behavior of our staff. We value you as a customer and want your repeat business. This will not happen again". Finis.

If they persist with atrocious behavior, their "empire" will come tumbling down. The dive community is a small one indeed.

 

[ScubaSteve]

Appropriate response from BD should be: "We apologize for the rude behavior of our staff. We value you as a customer and want your repeat business. This will not happen again". Finis.

If they persist with atrocious behavior, their "empire" will come tumbling down. The dive community is a small one indeed.

Why is it people believe that it is the company's responsibility to come into an SB thread to apologize or defend themselves. Some do, some don't. There is no "should be" response here......only "could be". As you've seen, people on both sides of the camp have pretty much made up their mind so the company stopping by is guaranteed to end badly for the company on one side or the other.

I do not judge a diver based on the weight they carry. I know that it is very easy to misread one or two sentences from a person (such as Irene) and to reply in a snarky tone and then to make their perception (real or not) a reality. Sometimes **** happens but the company has no obligation to you or anybody to come onto SB to explain their position. No matter what, people will still what away upset and calling them a liar. No win situation for them.

And they would have to persist for a long time and to a lot of people in several countries to crumble their "empire". Could it possibly happen? Sure. Are you being overly dramatic in your statement? Definitely.

 

[oly5050user]

Who cares if it's a lot. The person's a certified diver, it isn't a Disney ride where the random public just shows up, or somebody who's never been on a dive before. Give them the weights they want and move on, as a dive master is it really going to ruin your day if the guy is over-weighted?

Yes it would ruin my day if I have to do a rescue or worse recover a dead body and bring it to the boat and dock.
Not trying to be mean here, but helpful and avoid problems before they happen.

1) The diver showed us a C-card, he was certified and qualified and required to determine his own proper weighting. Every diver is required to determine his own weight requirements.

yes they are required to figure out how much lead they need.Most do not.Many think their bcd is an elevator-push a button go down,push other button go up..It ain't that way..

2) Every diver with a C-card has been certified that he knows how to drop his weights if he needs to.

In a stressful situation that goes out the window. Almost every fatality is recovered still wearing their weights! If properly weigh the need TO drop weights is reduced or removed entirely.You should be able to float with correct amount of lead on you with a fully deflated bcd.Only sink with a full exhale and rid yourself of residual tidal volume of air in lungs. Breath normal and you should simply float effortlessly.

3) Dive master was not there as an instructor, he was there as a guide to guide certified divers, to point out fish etc, certified divers are responsible for their own safety

.
Divemaster there for safety..Do not expect them to be a guide and point oout fish..Hell,a DM is not even required to be IN the water. The Dm should be ready to respond to any emergency from the surface when not being a guide. Yes certified divers are responsible for their own safety,many think they are safe but are really not in the experienced judgement of a professional that is on the water EVERY day.

If you're in any service industry and you feel the need to draw a line in the sand against a customer for a non-safety issue, that's 100% based on your ego and nothing more

.

Nope..I am 60 yrs old..My "ego" is not what controls my actions. Being safe and having to rescue someone who has so much lead on that their bcd barely keeps their chin above the surface of the water is my concern.

Feel free to do it, but be warned customers will vote with their dollars, they will report their experiences about you, and not just to their friends or family, but more likely online, and it will effect your income. If your ego is more important then anything else, then go for it, argue with divers about their weights. Why stop there? Why not scold the first diver who runs low on air? Why not point fingers and giggle at the over-weight divers on the boat, or the ones who are fair-skinned and show up white without a tan, argue with them about the amount of sun screen to use too.

If a customer is upset that I care about their safety and the enjoyment of others that may be on the boat ,then they can go elsewhere. Hell i would even suggest them to go to my competitor! I will not have to rescue them and explain to the authorities why I have a fatality. I would not argue with them about the amount of lead required, but suggest a better way and have them try it. Diver runs low on air? Advise them not to let it happen again as it is dangerous to themselves any whoever is in the water with them if they need to be rescued.Its just carelessness to run so low on air that it is an issue, just check your spg every so often..

 

[tridacna]

Why is it people believe that it is the company's responsibility to come into an SB thread to apologize or defend themselves.

C'mon Steve. I never stated that they "should come on SB to defend themselves". That's their prerogative. I said that should be the appropriate response. All this bulltwaddle about responsibilities is just that. This is just about being courteous.

And yes, Empires do collapse. I personally would not risk going there now. Why bother? Lots of other resorts on Bonaire. Why take a chance when I've been forewarned about their horrible attitude and rudeness?