Breathing off the BC

[blacknet]

NetDoc and all,

The excert that I posted is the technically correct method, anything else is a dead issue. My post failed to address solo diving, in which case you bring a seperate air source, i.e. pony bottle, nuff said.

Ed

 

[The Chairman]

but I don't have their manual to read it. I only know what I teach and what NAUI wants me to teach and why. While I think that the NOAA is a wonderful orginization, I don't belong to it and they do not authorize me to teach. Consequently, I will treat NAUI's methodology as the best thing I got going. They in turn, back me up in this.

 

[The Chairman]

Sounds really good to me, but:

"Even at 60 fpm you would be on the surface in 75 secs. Even with partially filled lungs, you would have more than enough air and would arrive way before hypoxia could set in."
-NetDoc.
Dr. Paul said that you got 5 minutes.
Hmmmmmmmmm.

Soooooooooooooo, it you have five minutes worth of air and it only takes 75 seconds to reach your goal (the surface) leaving approximately 3 minutes and 45 seconds of air as a margin, the problem is... what??? There was a point you were making. I honestly have missed it. Please elucidate. Maybe I missed the meaning behind the 5 minutes Dr Paul said we had, I am not sure. I know that I can hold my breath for barely two minutes on the surface, which would only give me a 45 second margin. The cold water would probably help some, but I am not a physician and don't fully understand the physiology of apnea diving.

 

[Popeye]

Lest we forget...
In a PM to me you said...

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Any debate we have will be about scuba, and in the forum.
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This was in response to me requesting that this personal "crap" be handled off of the forum.

I took your request to heart and now you slam me for it??? You can't have it both ways. You want it in PM or out here? It's your choice...

What part about "Any debate we have will be about scuba" did you miss?

Doesn't say "ad hominid" -anywhere-.

But 20 minutes later you were out here, sniffling away.

That piss poor example thing.

This is like watching a train wreck, where the cars keep piling into the ravine.

It's terrifying, but you just can't pull your eyes away.


quote:
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The last bastion of the utterly defeated.
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Sorry... that would be name calling. You're good at that, and I haven't called you one name on the public forum... other than "Pops".

Pops is fine with me. I do admit that "retail tire" is quite an insult, but I haven't used it in a while.

quote:
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It amazes me that you would criticize other's training with a response like this.
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No, you are the one criticizing me here. I merely indicated in great detail just how I would handle these situations and why. It appears that you are quite angry with me for NOT utilizing your bladder breathing technique in these scenarios. You take great care at twisting my words to try and mean something they aren't. I won't do the same with you. It's just plain petty.

You don't twist words, eh? See below.

And besides, we've repeatedly seen how you tailor your scenarios to fit your techniques.

And boy, do they sound good.

Unless you're solo, or stuck, that is.

BTW, I take it that you are certified to teach Scuba then? If so with what agency. I had a recent acquaintance tell me in a PM that

Hell, no. Who needs one? Besides, if your closed minded arrogance is the result of that system, who would want to be?

All you can do is crush ideas you can't understand. It's sad, really.

BTW #2, which of the nine points of my method for an ESA did you disagree with? I seem to remember you indicating that you actually agreed with them but they were just "off topic". Which parts did you find dangerous? Which were in error? I have answered many of your questions, please return the favor and answer at least some of mine.

Then re-read what I clearly said. Here, I'll get it for you:

"Good info(the 9 points), but as Rick Murchisom pointed out, completely off topic. Maybe Rick can start a thread split on how to avoid OOA. I'm sure that Doc wouldn't have a single thing to say that I wouldn't agree with."

Now, which part wasn't clear? The part where I said it was good info, or the part where I said I would probably agree with everything you said?

Help me out here.

Then tell us again how petty it is to twist words.


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That you would consider yourself a decent man for posting this is incredulous, but I doubt you have the dignity to be ashamed.
Especially when you were whining earlier about being accused of not helping divers in trouble.
There is nothing lower in the entire scuba world than wishing harm on another diver, and your words are evidence of your mental state.
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I do believe that I said I would be offering you my octo... and that you would be accepting it.

Sorry, Guru, your exact, -despicable- quote:

"I would be willing to bring some spare air down for you to prolong the agony. It would be my guess that you would happily accept my octo in short order."

Speaking of spin, your credibility is in an inverted one.


Now with all your misinformation dealt with, how bout my challenge?

I didn't hear any mention of that.

 

[Popeye]

NetDoc once bubbled...


Soooooooooooooo, it you have five minutes worth of air and it only takes 75 seconds to reach your goal (the surface) leaving approximately 3 minutes and 45 seconds of air as a margin, the problem is... what??? There was a point you were making. I honestly have missed it. Please elucidate. Maybe I missed the meaning behind the 5 minutes Dr Paul said we had, I am not sure. I know that I can hold my breath for barely two minutes on the surface, which would only give me a 45 second margin. The cold water would probably help some, but I am not a physician and don't fully understand the physiology of apnea diving.

WWWWWhhhhhhhhooooooosssssshhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!

Go back and read the post v e r r r y s l o w l y, and try and assume some sarcasm on my part.

If you still need me to explain it, just ask.

 

[Popeye]

NetDoc once bubbled...
but I don't have their manual to read it. I only know what I teach and what NAUI wants me to teach and why. While I think that the NOAA is a wonderful orginization, I don't belong to it and they do not authorize me to teach. Consequently, I will treat NAUI's methodology as the best thing I got going. They in turn, back me up in this.

Uhhhh huh. How illuminating...

 

[The Chairman]

it is obvious that Doug Frederick, aka "Popeye" is quite angry with me and has stopped being reasonable. He has continued to insult me even as I have tried to provide as much info as to my methodology and why I use it. While I have tried to be patient with him, I have reached the point where I cannot continue with his attitude and the way he twists my words. I wish him the best, but will put him on my ignore list for now.

However, if any of you are in need of clarifications from me on this subject, then please feel free to ask. You will be treated with respect and not called an "arrogant buffoon", "a train wreck", nor will I accuse you of "arrogantly crushing ideas" (didn't know I had that much influence) or the like. If you ask me questions (like whether I am certified as an instructor) I will do my level best to answer them and not greet you with a hostile question in it's stead.

It is easy to get into the trap of name calling and baseless accusations and so I have avoided this. They add nothing to the discussion and only cast the writer in a bad light. Maybe one day he can leave the vindictive one finds on Rec.scuba and learn to debate in a more civil tone. If the insults were directed at another user I would have moderated him a long time ago. Since they are at me, I will leave them so as to not create any conflict of interest. It has been a long standing tradition among the regulators on WWW.Scubaboard.com that we do not moderate threads in which we participate.

If any of you feel that I have crossed a line in any of my posts, please feel free to PM another moderator (or even me) or use the "Report this post to a Moderator" link that is found at the bottom of each and every post. Please be specific as to how you feel I have erred. I am a big boy, and I really do not mind at all.

 

[roakey]

blacknet once bubbled...
The excert that I posted is the technically correct method, anything else is a dead issue.

Great example how the private sector innovates and moves faster than government. Yup, "dead issue" is a good choice of words for that passage.

Everyone -- if you even vaugely suspect that you're OOA, get to your buddy and get gas. Analyze later when you have all the time in the world. If it turns out you were a flake and forgot to turn your gas on for example, turn it on and if you're OK to go, signal OK and continue the dive.

Lack of gas is the ONLY thing that you're in a race against the clock with -- never, ever race.

When I took my diving test for an aquarium diver one of the drills was a lost reg. On signal I pulled out my primary, tossed it over my shoulder and stuffed the backup in my mouth and then went feeling for the primary, retreived it and swapped the regs back.

The tester looked confused for a few seconds, then signalled OK and we went to the next drill. At the surface he commented "I never thought of going for the octo (sic) in such a situation."

Mainstream training institutions, keep up the good work! (NOT!).

Roak

 

[blacknet]

roakey once bubbled...

Great example how the private sector innovates and moves faster than government. Yup, "dead issue" is a good choice of words for that passage.

Everyone -- if you even vaugely suspect that you're OOA, get to your buddy and get gas. Analyze later when you have all the time in the world. If it turns out you were a flake and forgot to turn your gas on for example, turn it on and if you're OK to go, signal OK and continue the dive.

Lack of gas is the ONLY thing that you're in a race against the clock with -- never, ever race.

When I took my diving test for an aquarium diver one of the drills was a lost reg. On signal I pulled out my primary, tossed it over my shoulder and stuffed the backup in my mouth and then went feeling for the primary, retreived it and swapped the regs back.

The tester looked confused for a few seconds, then signalled OK and we went to the next drill. At the surface he commented "I never thought of going for the octo (sic) in such a situation."

Mainstream training institutions, keep up the good work! (NOT!).

Roak

Roakey,

Please cite for us your authority to supercede N.O.A.A. and your credentials that outranks anything that N.O.A.A. puts out in this manner.

Ed

 

[The Chairman]

when my class does the retrieve regulator skill I EMPHASIZE that I really don't care which reg you come up with... just stick SOMETHING in your mouth! AND DO IT RIGHT NOW!!! :tease: No matter how much I stress it though, I still get that paniced look from someone when they stick the octo in their mouth. Thats why we repeat that drill ad nauseum, until they are ultra comfortable with it.