Big Day for Californians

[mofosaurus]

this sounds bad but if we could stop people from moving to California from other areas of the US alot of the problems would resolve themselves

we don't need more businesses, we need less people

 

[Karl_in_Calif]

mofosaurus once bubbled...
this sounds bad but if we could stop people from moving to California from other areas of the US alot of the problems would resolve themselves

we don't need more businesses, we need less people

Yah, but thats what the Native Americans in California said as well, before the white man (Spanish) came.

I suppose Gov Conan can go begging to the "Indian Tribes" to pay up more taxes, but being from Austria he probably does not appreciate that only the U.S. Federal Government is empowered to make treaties with the "Indians" not the State of California.

The Native Americans are a sovereign nation. While they are on their treaty lands, Federal lands, they are exempt from Federal and State taxation.

 

[norcaldiver]

RichLockyer once bubbled...

It has not always been there. It was put in place under the Dukmejian administration.
Edit: It was not implemented in the 1980s... it was implemented in 1935.

Good catch. It's been there as long as MOST of us have been around, so I say always.

It was illegal from the start, as it was imposed without a 2/3 vote of the legislature or a vote of the people, but it was called a "fee" instead of a "tax" to it skated through.

Technically no it wasn't illegal. It was triggered by the fiscal situation we find in CA now. Davis didn't come up with that one. The State financial wiz did. ONLY after Davis tried to raise some taxes, and the reps shot them all down. The only thing left that would bring in more money was killing the VLF rebate. It didn't NEED 2/3 vote to go into effect, as written right into the rebate plan originally.

Is it a tax, yeah, really it is, but Davis didn't come up with it, he just happened to be in office when the rebate was recalled.

Now, the thing is, the VLF is, by law, going to local govt's, not the state. In 1998, things were great here with the IPOs and all, so they said, hey, lets give them a break and knock down the VLF, then since the state is rich, we can back fill that money to the local govt. That was great for a while, then the dot com bust hit, along with some over-priced electricity. Now the state doesn't have the money to make up that lost income to the local govt's, and needs to bring the VLF back. AGAIN, this was a known outcome when the VLF rebate started.

 

[norcaldiver]

mofosaurus once bubbled...
this sounds bad but if we could stop people from moving to California from other areas of the US alot of the problems would resolve themselves

we don't need more businesses, we need less people

Other states? How about stopping people from certain neighboring countries...and I ain't talking about Canada.....

 

[Dryglove]

norcaldiver once bubbled...


Other states? How about stopping people from certain neighboring countries...and I ain't talking about Canada.....

Why bother when Davis was gonna give them a drivers license anyways

 

[Karl_in_Calif]

The USA should colonize Mexico. If the Mexicans want in so bad, let them come. But make it official. Take Mexico and make it the 51st state.

 

[mofosaurus]

The US has colonized Mexico and those colonies are called California, Arizona, New Mexico, Colorado and Texas.

I still say its the people from back east that are the problem

 

[adder70]

Karl_in_Calif once bubbled...


The Native Americans are a sovereign nation. While they are on their treaty lands, Federal lands, they are exempt from Federal and State taxation.

So, if you are leaving the US, then there is no reason the local/state/US government can't treat it like any other border. I bet a checkpoint with border guards would put a serious hurt on the Native American gambling income, especially if winnings of gamblers are subject to duties/special taxes for cash/income from out of country.

Then you could broach the whole foreign driver license issue, or refuse to issue US licenses to people not living in the US. Which tribes have their own driver education and licensing programs? How long before inadequately trained drivers would bring about the refusal to accept NA driver licenses? Let the NA people govern themselves completely, including the admin expenses and such.

What about people living in the US and working abroad? Special taxes here too, I believe. Do NA casino employees not living in the NA lands pay these taxes?

There are always degrees of sovereignty.

 

[drbill]

Adder70- If I understand it correctly, you are not leaving the US when you enter tribal lands since Karl_in_calif mentioned their lands are federal. Perhaps we need border guards all around the State of California to keep them "furriners" (Swedes, Irish, Pakistanis, Koreans, Chileans, Australians, etc.) out. At least the Mexicans have an historic claim to most of "our" lands.

If US corporations (agribusiness, etc.) didn't need the labor these folks provide, perhaps the laws would be tightened. Until they are willing to forego larger profits (and value to their stockholders, us) and we (especially those posters railing against the Mexican laborers) are willing to pay higher prices for California agricultural products, you'll see market forces dictate the policy.

Dr. Bill

 

[adder70]

norcaldiver once bubbled...


quote:
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It was illegal from the start, as it was imposed without a 2/3 vote of the legislature or a vote of the people, but it was called a "fee" instead of a "tax" to it skated through.
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Technically no it wasn't illegal. It was triggered by the fiscal situation we find in CA now. Davis didn't come up with that one. The State financial wiz did. ONLY after Davis tried to raise some taxes, and the reps shot them all down. The only thing left that would bring in more money was killing the VLF rebate. It didn't NEED 2/3 vote to go into effect, as written right into the rebate plan originally.

Perhaps Rich can clear this up, but I believe when he said "from the start" he was referring to the original enactment in 1935, not to Davis stopping the rebate. So the 2/3 vote was not needed for the end of the rebate to go into effect, assuming you trust the legality of the original plan.