Suggestion Bannings...

[The Chairman]

OK gang... give me some input.

What should (if anything) warrant a temp ban (5 day suspension)?

What should (if anything) warrant a perm ban?

 

[cornfed]

Thank You Boogie. You saying that helps. I also have been feeling very badly about this..as are many of the Mods.
It might not seem like it, but we are people too.

Natasha, I understand that there is a person attached to that keyboard. At least for me, this has a lot to do with a feeling that the rank and file members aren't being treated as people.

 

[Spectre]

For example...

"Cornfed was banned because he violated our policy regarding the consumption of corn-on-the-cob. Scubaboard is a family forum and it is our intention that it remain as such. We do not feel that having corn kernels stuck between your teeth is inconsistent with values of the forum staff nor with the majority of our members. We appreciate your understanding in this matter."

Step back a second. Look at the other side.

Where should this be posted? Suggestions and Feedback? Board News? Not to make you feel small or anything, but of the 20,000 members here, how many know who you are, or care that you were banned? Do we post it in the Tech forums, or the DIR forums, or in the JAFR forums?

What if it's read by others that have no idea of the seriousness of your corn consumption. Hell, I rarely eat corn-on-the-cob because of the corn kernels ending up in my teeth. Generally corn-on-the-cob is being served at parties and tailgates and other places where I'm far from some dental floss. I'm now _really_ concerned that those-of-infinite-free-time will catch me post cob-consuming, pre-flossing, and I'll be tossed next!

[hmm... sounds a lot like the panic that the subject of expiring and revokeable C cards generates].

How do the moderators limit it to those that would know or care, and keep it from those that won't understand?

Do you see the point here? What would be better, moderators burning out due to constant policies and discussions around how to correctly word something so it doesn't blow back up in their faces because the torch bearers are just looking for another excuse to further their cause that the MAN is trying to keep me down, or the mods dealing with what needs to be dealt with, so we can continue with what we're here for... to discuss diving!

Sure... there's lots of "if they just.. .if they just.. if they just" getting bantered about. But just like natasha says, this stuff sucks. It's hard enough trying to explain where explinations are _needed_, and until you've been there, you don't understand that it's virtually impossible to be of clear enough thought to word something that won't cause more non-diving related banter about the board.

I find it supremely aggravating that people can recognize why a moderated board is preferable to an unmoderated forum, yet feel the need to beat those trying to provide such a service to the point of frustration.

 

[carebear]

If I didn't... I wouldn't have wasted countless hours/days of time and insane amounts of ulcer medication to try and explain the other side.

I have been here awhile, and it seems to me there is an endless war about the mods against everyone else. All of this is really entertaining to watch unfold, and being a professional mediator, I am willing to offer my unsolicited advice, however since I am not being paid, I will spare you the tact I usually show my clients, LOL...
to the participants in the forum - yes it sucks your friends are gone, but are you really looking for answers or do you want to know the juicy details? From my perspective, I didn't see Raven and Cobaltbabe causing all that much trouble, but IMO, the rules for suspension are clear. In criminal activity guilt by association is punishable. Perhaps that was enough here.
I often state my opinion, and thus far have never been banned, and if I do get banned, I'm sure I will be deserving. I don't think you have need to worry about being banned if you conduct yourself appropriately.
Jeff and Natasha, my respect for you has multiplied now that this crud is going on. I see your job can be really difficult and seemingly unrewarding. Speaking of, why would you want to do it in the first place? lol

 

[Spectre]

Jeff and Natasha, my respect for you has multiplied now that this crud is going on. I see your job can be really difficult and seemingly unrewarding. Speaking of, why would you want to do it in the first place?

Please... hand all the respect over to Natasha and the rest of the mods. I definately don't deserve any! If I was still up there, I'm sure I'd be main-lining Pepto by now.

 

[IndigoBlue]

...as I read your post I was thinking... boy, I am glad we can't get voted off of the island because people hate us! I would be the first to go! Can I at least keep the Rolls?

Pete, now that you own the island, I hope it will be a kinder, gentler island.

You have a couple of moderators who are problematic. I hope you will be able to fix that.

You have several moderators who are outstanding. Uncle Pug is my favorite.

You seem to have a couple of current members who were involved in prior frays in which some but not all participants were banned. I suspect these current members feel like the cat that ate the canary, in that they are still posting here, whereas others are not, partly due to them.

It seems like your members are benefitted by intelligent discussions of scuba issues. Several visitors have posted that the feedback they received here was very beneficial to their scuba classes or to their continuing scuba development. When that happens, it is a win-win for everyone.

When a post is a mere slam of another person, that post should be deleted, if not the entire thread also deleted, in my opinion. When someone replies to a personal slam in kind, it's like the NFL then here, in that the last person to reply is often unfairly punished while the original slam artist gets away with it. In the past, that has partly seemed to be related to the former owner (King Neptune) being partial to certain individuals on the board, from previous friendships and involvements. Hopefully that will completely discontinue.

Good luck, Pete. You are never going to be able to make everyone anywhere happy. So good luck.

 

[cornfed]

Step back a second. Look at the other side.

Where should this be posted? Suggestions and Feedback? Board News? Not to make you feel small or anything, but of the 20,000 members here, how many know who you are, or care that you were banned? Do we post it in the Tech forums, or the DIR forums, or in the JAFR forums?

I'm not suggesting a "Suspended User's" forum or anything. And I completely understand that I'm a very small fish in a very large pond. What I would expect is someone to answer the question if it's possed. If someone cares enough to start a thread, answer it there. If someone pms a moderator the mod should be able to answer them.

How do the moderators limit it to those that would know or care, and keep it from those that won't understand?

Do you see the point here?

Yes I understand your point and if you didn't have some many good one's this would be easier!

What would be better, moderators burning out due to constant policies and discussions around how to correctly word something so it doesn't blow back up in their faces because the torch bearers are just looking for another excuse to further their cause that the MAN is trying to keep me down

Honestly, Jeff, I don't know. This is a tough one. You're always going to have people like this and personally I think you should just ignore them. If someone wants to think that the mafia is influencing moderator selections can you honestly expect to have a rational conversation with them? No matter what you do they'll still be pissed. I'm trying to base my arguments on satisfying the "rational man standard" and not the "Grassy knoll standard".

Sure... there's lots of "if they just.. .if they just.. if they just" getting bantered about. But just like natasha says, this stuff sucks. It's hard enough trying to explain where explinations are _needed_, and until you've been there, you don't understand that it's virtually impossible to be of clear enough thought to word something that won't cause more non-diving related banter about the board.

You're right, I have absolutely no idea what it's like being a moderator and having to deal with this. But I can say that I've been on both sides of the discipline stick and know they BOTH suck. But it's easier for everyone to stomach if you understand. And the problem is that people don't seem to understand. Some of the people who where banned don't seem to understand why they were. That's one problem. Another problem is people like me who have witnessed all this and don't understand. From my vantage point it looks like some long standing and respected members have been given the boot for no reason. For all I know I could be doing the same thing and have one foot out the door.

I like to think I operate at a PG-13 rating. But maybe this is more of a PG or even G rated board. I don't know, it's kind of hard to tell from the TOS. I think feedback from the moderators and board staff would be valuable in helping people interpret the TOS. I guess I'm just looking for ways to help me understand the rules so I can be sure I'm playing by them. In case you haven't noticed I changed my signature line a while back!

I find it supremely aggravating that people can recognize why a moderated board is preferable to an unmoderated forum, yet feel the need to beat those trying to provide such a service to the point of frustration.

I'm not trying to brow-beat anyone and I sincerely hope my comments haven't come across that way. I appreciate what the moderators do. I've offered my suggests in the hope that they might help alleviate some of their frustration.

 

[dbulmer]

It seems like your members are benefitted by intelligent discussions of scuba issues. Several visitors have posted that the feedback they received here was very beneficial to their scuba classes or to their continuing scuba development. When that happens, it is a win-win for everyone.
.....

Good luck, Pete. You are never going to be able to make everyone anywhere happy. So good luck.

A couple of months I came close to giving up Scuba completely. I was scared - Jepuskar was one of the people who offered some advice.

A couple of weeks later I came across SeaJay. His enthusiasm was a ray of sunshine and inspiration for me personally. It saddens me that the moderators felt it appropriate to take action for whatever reason. That said, I think Boogie has a valid point - if you are going to ban someone then at least give an indication why ... if you single someone out then it has to act as a deterrent and should be explained.

Sometimes in the thrust of a heated thread, things are said that should not be - sometimes leaving a person to stew on their own comments can be ample punishment. If the trangressions of SeaJay et al are unforgiveable then fair enough but at least offer some explanation .

A ban should be the final straw - sometimes what we post comes back to haunt us and over time our appreciation of SCUBA changes due to our personal experience -

Life is too short to be bitter. One day those people could go out and not come back - we all know that!

 

[DivingGal]

Wow... open discussion or what?

Every once and awhile threads like this get started, and some of the ideas that come out of them are useful and adopted by the board. Many of the ideas here are being discussed among the mods... there are arguments on both sides or is that all sides as nothing is truely black or white in this discussion.

The mods all get paid big bucks to try and keep things moving on a smooth and even ride... just kidding about the big bugs, it's all voluntary. As mentioned by one (or more) member we're all human on the other side of the keyboard.

Keep the suggestions coming... I for one appreciate new ideas being suggested (even if I don't always agree with them)

 

[ckharlan66]

... just kidding about the big bugs...

No you aren't...."big bugs" is about all we get.

Chad

 

[cornfed]

Keep the suggestions coming... I for one appreciate new ideas being suggested

Actually... I'd like some feed back from you guys. I'd like to hear the moderators take on some of the ideas suggested.