Bahamas: Missing Female Diver

[deepstops]

No more posts from me, you have my word

The adage "Never argue with a pig. It just frustrates you and irritates the pig" comes to mind.

Without facts, speculation is perfectly acceptable but trying to place blame is not.

 

[Thalassamania]

My tune has not shifted, accident investigations are never perfect, data is never complete, reconstructions are never perfect, if there's anything that I've learned in the over two thousand diving fatalities that I've analyzed, it's that the simplest explanation is most often the most accurate.

The simplest explanation here is that the Instructor screwed the pooch. What she needed to do was grab the victim's tank valve and establish positive buoyancy, she failed to even attempt to do that and seems to have gone astray and become involved in some sort of completely unnecessary struggle with the victim. Why she did this is a question of interest, but the exact reason has little bearing on her failure to secure a strong grip on the victim's tank valve and establish positive buoyancy.

She will, doubtless, have rationalizations as to why she was unable to accomplish these simple tasks, but the fact remains ... she came back up alone.

 

[Web Monkey]

Claiming that any DM you trained could have produced a different result is hard to believe. For all you know the victim may have been pulling off the DMs mask and 2nd stage along with poking her fingers in her eyes. I doubt she wrote out harsh words on a slate and this drove the DM away.

The victim was apparently an elderly woman. It's unlikely she could have posed a threat to anybody but herself.

In any case, proper DM training would have allowed the DM to control the situation and surface with the woman with minimal danger.

Terry

 

[dumpsterDiver]

I like the tone of this thread lately. Treat DM as professionals who have an actual responsibility to be attentive and also to intervene effectively regardless of the cause of the victim's combativeness, narcosis or suicidal intent.

Not so much BS about don't do anything that you are uncomfortable doing, don't do something that might scare you or get your mask ripped off etc.

 

[Web Monkey]

As someone has already said, if I am going down that deep I AM hauling someone's ass back up.

That was me. If someone has screwed up bad enough to need rescuing, I no longer care about whether or not they like me or approve of my decision. They can be as pissed off as they want, but if I can gain contact, I'm not surfacing alone.

Aside from carrying serious underwater weapons, I can't imagine what an elderly woman could do to prevent a qualified DM from performing a rescue.

I hope more information is forthcoming at some point, since this is just really bizarre sounding right now.

Terry

 

[stevejaz]

My tune has not shifted, accident investigations are never perfect, data is never complete, reconstructions are never perfect, if there's anything that I've learned in the over two thousand diving fatalities that I've analyzed, it's that the simplest explanation is most often the most accurate.

The simplest explanation here is that the Instructor screwed the pooch. What she needed to do was grab the victim's tank valve and establish positive buoyancy, she failed to even attempt to do that and seems to have gone astray and become involved in some sort of completely unnecessary struggle with the victim. Why she did this is a question of interest, but the exact reason has little bearing on her failure to secure a strong grip on the victim's tank valve and establish positive buoyancy.

She will, doubtless, have rationalizations as to why she was unable to accomplish these simple tasks, but the fact remains ... she came back up alone.

While I can't say that I totally disagree with you...given the uncertainty of the facts by your own admission do you really want to make that strong and insensative of a statement? If that DM were standing in front of you, would that be what you'd say to her? As for all you know, you may have just done that but from the anonymity of sitting behind your computer.

 

[Thalassamania]

While I can't say that I totally disagree with you...given the uncertainty of the facts by your own admission do you really want to make that strong and insensative of a statement? If that DM were standing in front of you, would that be what you'd say to her? As for all you know, you may have just done that but from the anonymity of sitting behind your computer.

I'd ask her what happened, weigh her testimony against that of others and the fact that can other wise be discerned and tell her what conclusion I reached. Would I have any problem telling her that based on what I know know, where that to stand unrefuted, it would indicate that she screwed up badly? No problem what-so-ever. Because anonimity works both ways you don't realize that I've had to do it in the past concerning deaths at sea, and while it's never fun, it's never easy, it comes with the territory.

 

[Katamuki]

Two weeks ago on a deep drift dive off of Aguni island (but not more than 28 meters deep or so with a 30 meter floor...) a largish diver was entranced by the swirling fishie tornadoes and not only left the group in the 2.5 know current but went much deeper than the agreed upon max depth. It took two seperate times for the "little japanese girl" to snag his tank valve and haul him back up AGAINST HIS WILL. This little japanese girl is a 7 yr veteran of the Yanaguni dive sites and is headed to Bonin island to DM dives with sperm whales. A very good and powerful swimmer despite her mayb 105lb weight. The diver weighed 240lbs or maybe a little more. On the ascent after he calmed down he ended up OOA at which point the DM aided him. What is so bad about this is that when he had left the small group of 5 divers initially he ignored the tank banging she was doing with a reef hook and then ignored her "air checks" on the way up until he ran out. He was counseled on the boat by the crew and ended up sitting out the next dive.

 

[stevejaz]

I'd ask her what happened, weigh her testimony against that of others and the fact that can other wise be discerned and tell her what conclusion I reached.

That makes sense, and I believe in being straight up...but you haven't heard her side yet, my guess is she can't even officially tell her side at this point.

My point is, I think a lot of people on here come to conclusions and say things they never would if they were speaking face to face with the concerned individual.

I'm not saying you're that way, in reading your posts, I'm guessing that you would give your analysis of the situation in no uncertain terms after hearing her side of the story but unless it was a blatant incompetance, I'd also guess you'd be a little more eloquent and compassionate about it.

 

[DocIndyDiver]

What about the Husband? We've seemed to have forgotten he was on the dive & boat. What was his demeanor...distraught, devastated or cool as a cucumber? Did he dive the second dive? I've kept up with this thread and I have not seen much comment on this. If anyone has first or second hand knowledge please chime in.