Bad vis. How bad is too bad?

[danvolker]

To me the question is at what vis level does it stop being fun/enjoyable?
I know we are talking about a training senario but heck if I was doing my OW in four foot or less vis I'd be saying "wheres the enjoyment in this?"
At the end of the day isn't that as big a part of training as teaching the skills - whetting the appetite for things to come.
That said. --I DO feel that a low vis dive as part of a training package would be a great idea.

Once situational awareness is well engrained, and buddy responsibilities are taken seriously, I think a new diver should be taught or should practice some diving in very low viz...less than 5 foot viz. However, I think this is more for future safety , than it is for enjoyment. I don't see most of us enjoying 5 foot visibility or even 10 feet, with anything close to the experience potential we have in 20 foot viz or above....
The exception would be the diver's who love macro. They can spend 30 minutes in a 5 foot square area, focusing down on life the size of a grain of rice...and they may not even be aware that they only have 5 foot viz
For those of us whose enjoyment comes from watching the huge, active interplay between millions of species, having good visibility is a big plus.

 

[drl]

I chose 4-6 feet. I'm 5'2", and if I can't see as far as my own feet it's not worth bothering!

 

[Charlie99]

I'm spoiled by Maui. For a buddy dive, viz less than 10 or 15' means the dive isn't worth doing.

For a solo dive, though, I'll usually go ahead and do it as long as the viz is bigger than the surge. I prefer to see the rocks and isolated coral heads before being slammed into them. If I hit the water for a solo dive and the viz is horrible (i.e. less than 10'), I usually just do some navigation skills and note the bearing and distance between various points of the reef for future reference.

 

[Frosty]

I'm spoiled by Maui. For a buddy dive, viz less than 10 or 15' means the dive isn't worth doing.

For a solo dive, though, I'll usually go ahead and do it as long as the viz is bigger than the surge. I prefer to see the rocks and isolated coral heads before being slammed into them. If I hit the water for a solo dive and the viz is horrible (i.e. less than 10'), I usually just do some navigation skills and note the bearing and distance between various points of the reef for future reference.

Actually on that front it was pretty funny the first dive my wife did in "our" training lake. 10-12 feet (3-4m) vis and there were fish galore including a 5 foot long eel
She complained about the low vis.-She was spoiled for sure by the 80 foor plus fiz in the tropics

 

[The Light Eternal]

Rescue is a FUN course. But, it is heavily heavily task loaded. At one point during the training, you will be required to FIND a person who is unresponsive, bring that person to the surface, and begin performing continuous do-not-stop CPR on that person WHILE you remove all of his gear and your gear. The entire time, swiming the towards shore or boat.

Think about all of those activities. That is one test. Not, find the person. Good. Now do CPR. Good. Now take gear off. Good. Now swim to shore. Good.

Go diving!!

Um how does one do CPR whilst diving? We have to put a stiff board under our patients for it to be effective.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

You don't do CPR compressions. All that does is drown the person more:shocked2:. What they are talking about is rescue breaths. The thing with that though is that even just doing those is very problematic in deep water. I have been pulled under numerous times by rescue students trying to deliver them in practice. Even for accomplished rescue divers and instructors it is difficult. You need to have both the vic and the rescuer very positive and try to get up high enough to not turn the head and close the airway. Frankly for the average setting they provide psychological help to the rescuer IMO and not much to the vic. SEI is currently gathering data to see as well how much time is lost doing this as each time you need to breathe you have to stop the tow. I teach what is in the standards now but also strongly advise a better strategy MAY be to tow the vic as fast as possible to the shore or boat after trying the two initial breaths and getting them to a place where proper CPR can be done. Even if it;s getting them to water shallow enough for the rescuer to stand and deliver the breaths. Still can do compressions but if the vic is too big for the rescuer to get out of the water they can breathe until help comes.

 

[The Light Eternal]

In my professional opinion if the person is in cardiac arrest you should not even bother wasting time with breaths until you can also give compressions. There is no medical benefit to oxygenating uncirculating blood, especially if doing so delays CPR. Considering all the research backing this I am very surprised in-ocean rescue breaths are in any kind of layperson diving course.

 

[Jim Lapenta]

They were put in way back in the 60's before we knew what we did today. Based on current research I agree with you completely. Get em out of the water as fast as possible where real care can take place. But until the agencies change things up we have to teach the way we do and tell divers the real life stuff. Like drysuit diving. Books say BC on surface and suit underwater. Stupid. Enough air to offset squeeze and BC for everything else. The dive industry seems slow to change in some areas and relatively fast in others.

 

[The Light Eternal]

That's a pretty silly thing to be slow about but I guess there probably aren't enough deaths for them to be motivated :-/

 

[bowlofpetunias]

I'm putting my hand up for those crying ridiculous. International Liaison Committee on Resuscitation recommended years ago that focus needs to be on compressions. No point in putting air (and potentially water) into the lungs if the blood isn't circulating. Get them to somewhere you can actually accomplish something worthwhile!

IMHO there is no excuse for the dive industry to stay in the dark ages with something this vital to the well being of divers!