August 2012, Rebreather diver lost in the G ?

[Doc]

Just heard that a CCR diver was lost off of a liveaboard operation.

Didn't know that any licensed dive guides had CCR gear or were even certified for it.

That's all I got. Anyone?

 

[laurenceh]

we dove with several ccr's divers last year aboard the humboldt explorer. my friend jorge mahauad of galapagos rebreathers provides logistical support, gases etc. to ccr divers in the galapagos. i know he just returned from a 30 dive private boat rental to the northern isles supporting a 3-d film crew and all went off without a hitch. i will contact him and see if he's heard anything.

ps. andy phillips of udc organizes a ccr trip to darwin and wolf every september, the 2013 trip still has two vacancies if you're interested.

 

[laurenceh]

no info

 

[Dom@DiveAdvice]

Very sad - a CCR diver was lost off Wolf on August 14. No details of what happened. To my knowledge, other than jorge mahauad Advanced Diving in the Galapagos Islands and Ecuador.: The final two dives of this trip and rebreather thinking and thanking, none of the Galapagos guides are certified in rebreathers. However several boats offer to supply the necessary backup materials for CCR divers to bring their own setup. They are still limited by the same Park Rules as everyone else that they can only be underwater with the guide and a buddy, and limiting their dive time to that of the guide, essentially meaning 60 minute maximum dives, but other than that, there are no restrictions. I believe in this case that the boat actually has some CCR's on board, and the guides therefore may have some training in their use. With revolutionary advances in technology, more and more live-aboards are now offering training in the new Poseidon Discovery MKVI recreational rebreather and a number of boats have systems for rent on board. I am sure there will be discussions and viewpoints on whether these CCR's should be more widely available for recreational divers, but those I have spoken to feel very comfortable that they are. Will let you know if we get more news on the events in Galapagos.

 

[Doppler]

Thank you... Very sad.

 

[jorge.a.mahauad]

As far as I know this is the first ever fatality using a CCR in the islands. I have been avoiding posting in this forum about this but when my name is listed here I need to address it. I wasn't the guide, I did not witness this accident and I never had personal contact of any kind with the travel agent or the divers on this trip.

As a rebreather diver, rebreather fatalities are very upsetting to me; even if I didn’t meet the person involved, there is some sort of connection among CCR divers; I tend to call it the silent side.

This has been more so when the accident happened in the market I am slowly developing.

I am a PADI Course Director, Technical Diving and Rebreather Instructor with PADI and TDI. I run Galapagos Rebreathers, a very small specialist rebreather travel firm that provides logistical support, equipment rentals and rebreather oriented travel options.

At this time, Galapagos Rebreathers is the only firm actively offering rebreather support for people who want rebreather travel opportunities to the Galapagos Islands and I am the only active CCR professional in the region. There are no other operations with a resident instructor trainer and locally experienced rebreather professional on staff; not even with a trained closed circuit rebreather diver. I am also not aware of any live-aboard company actively offering CCR travel opportunities by its own.

We are still in the very early ages of recreational rebreather diving and the fact is that rebreather diving requires rebreather oriented operations.

Since 2010, Galapagos Rebreathers has successfully supported over 5 different rebreather friendly live-aboard trips with a total of 10 rebreather divers who have performed over 300 hours of completely safe, professionally supported and rebreather supervised diving. I work in affiliation with the most renowned rebreather diving professionals and instructor trainers in their regions.

The information I do have about the accident follows:

The victim was diving the only CCR unit on the trip. The victim’s rebreather instructor was present as a buddy but diving open circuit. Victim was diving without an off board bailout below 60 feet. After the accident, the diluent cylinder was found empty.

In my opinion, the limited availability rebreather service here in the Galapagos has been a good thing so far. It has avoided accidents like this.

I think rebreathers need to remain a small niche until technology and training develop simple response mechanisms like quick open circuit bailout and reinforce good rebreather diving habits like diving with other CCR divers and having off board bailout gas for dives deeper than 60 feet.

I am not affiliated or endorse any third party live-aboard or land based operation and I work equally with any of them, regardless of my personal preferences. If you are a rebreather diver wanting to come to the Galapagos, or a travel agent with divers requiring CCR support, please contact me personally. One fatality is already too many.

 

[Wookie]

This is sadly an example of a boat operator tying to get into that "lucrative rebreather market" or allowing a guest to dictate their own terms "let me bring my rebreather or else I won't book" without having adequate support staff on the vessel. Didn't have offboard gas below 60 feet? What about didn't have offboard gas at all? I don't know of a single manufacturer or training agency that advocates rebreather dives of any kind without offboard gas.

This is a completely stupid preventable tragedy that didn't have to happen, and the harder the big training agencies push the "anyone can dive, and anyone can dive a rebreather" message, more stupid events will happen. If a boat is going to allow rebreather diving, the captain or someone in the crew has to be at least familiar with rebreathers, so some idiot doesn't convince the captain that "it's alright, I dive without bailout all the time".

Jorge, thank you for your efforts to bring safe rebreather diving to the liveaboard community in the Galapagos. It's too bad that someone thought that you were too expensive or that your services weren't needed. I wonder how the widow feels now......

 

[archiebald]

This is sadly an example of a boat operator tying to get into that "lucrative rebreather market" or allowing a guest to dictate their own terms "let me bring my rebreather or else I won't book" without having adequate support staff on the vessel. Didn't have offboard gas below 60 feet? What about didn't have offboard gas at all? I don't know of a single manufacturer or training agency that advocates rebreather dives of any kind without offboard gas.

This is a completely stupid preventable tragedy that didn't have to happen, and the harder the big training agencies push the "anyone can dive, and anyone can dive a rebreather" message, more stupid events will happen. If a boat is going to allow rebreather diving, the captain or someone in the crew has to be at least familiar with rebreathers, so some idiot doesn't convince the captain that "it's alright, I dive without bailout all the time".

I am sorry to sound hard hearted. I am just a beginner OC diver but one of the things I have learned well in my short diving time is "dive conservatively" and "dive within you own experience level".

Without knowing all the facts, your post seems to put all the blame on others such as training agencies and boat operators. Whatever happened to personal responsibility?

 

[Wookie]

I am sorry to sound hard hearted. I am just a beginner OC diver but one of the things I have learned well in my short diving time is "dive conservatively" and "dive within you own experience level".

Without knowing all the facts, your post seems to put all the blame on others such as training agencies and boat operators. Whatever happened to personal responsibility?

You are right. You are a new diver, and you don't understand rebreathers or what I was trying to say. I put the blame here squarely on the diver for not diving with bailout, on the instructor for not instilling the need for bailout in his student, and the operator for not having written procedures requiring the diver to have off-board bailout. One of the very first things I was taught in rebreather diving is you never go into the water without an open circuit backup. The few divers who have tried to dive from my boat without a bailout system are invited to leave, or not to show up at all.

I've noticed you jump right into conversations not with a questioning attitude, but like you want to tell us all how much you've learned in your 0-24 dive career. Why don't you sit back and pay attention and learn a few things before you stun us all with your font of wisdom. IJS. Yes, I am a butthole. That is well established.

 

[archiebald]

Wookie,
If my post came across that way then I am sorry.

I do a lot of lurking here and DO read an awful lot in an effort to learn more. I have done all my few dives with my 13 year old daughter which maybe makes me more sensitive to checking our own safety.

There are numerous discussions in these boards regarding certification cards versus dives logged and attitudes toward safety. I was reading one just the other day that questioned whether more experienced divers sometimes cut corners because they have fallen into bad habits.

I agree that there should be rules set in stone by all concerned but I feel strongly that doing anything safely in life must start at the personal level. Not just in diving but in virtually every case where an incident occurs nowadays, I feel people are too quick to look for scapegoats to blame when they should sometimes simply look in the mirror.

Once again, apologies for any misunderstanding.