Atomic 1st stage sealing is getting expensive

[Hatul]

Are you just suggesting move to the jet seat style and saving money by buying Monel instead of Titanium? (I don't even know if they still have pre Jet seat stuff anymore for sale. The latest price list does not list the original Titanium Piston anymore, so I guess that answers that.)

---------- Post added July 2nd, 2013 at 07:16 PM ----------



It's not any less likely to attract crap than silicone.

What I have noticed in rebuilding gear packed with Christolube and Silicone:
Silicone flows more, and over time gets thinner it seems. Where it stays, it tends to protect against corrosion better than Christolube becasue the pasty-ness of Christolube makes it not necessarily flow to all the nooks and crannies. But Christolube stays.

This lack of flow of the Christolube is why Atomic has that special packing tool because it needs some real pressure to flow to all the nooks and crannies.

---------- Post added July 2nd, 2013 at 07:27 PM ----------



That's at least partly a function of Titanium, not the sealing. Titanium is non-reactive, and chrome is reactive to sea-water. I have crapped out basically all my chromed brass regulators, and my Atomic titanium regs look like they are brand new all the time. At least the metal parts do.

I wonder how the Monel lasts in bad conditions.

I only use Atomic Second stages myself, but I work on the first stages. No one kills their gear quite like pros, and no pro I know uses the Titanium first stages. I have seen a couple of dead Z1 second stages crapped out from corrosion.

If you mean scuba pros, they don't exactly make good income to afford Titanium. The corroded Z1 second stage may be from obstacles to soaking as a result of the seat saver?

 

[eelnoraa]

If you mean scuba pros, they don't exactly make good income to afford Titanium. The corroded Z1 second stage may be from obstacles to soaking as a result of the seat saver?

I highly doubt 2nd stage corrosion is about the seat saver. The seat saver let water into the LP hose. If you have corrosion in 1st stage, seat saver can still be one of the reasons. All 2nd stages, seat saver or not, the inside is wet when submerg.

But, isn't 99.999% of regulators ever made today are chrome brass? If this material has issue, then all regulators will have issue by now. I think the main cost of corrosion is still user error.

 

[halocline]

The monel piston was not that much more and given that the gas flow across the edge is potential hot spot I figured I would hedge my bets.

Are you saying the piston edge heats up as the gas goes by it? Or do you mean 'hot spot' figuratively?

The piston edge is cooled by the expanding air, I suspect you know that. In fact, it's probably the coldest spot on the first stage.

 

[Dr. Lecter]

My understanding is that the edge presented problems for particle impingement.

 

[Paulmal]

I do not have my M1's sealed when I get them serviced. I see no point to waist the extra money when I dive 72 degree water year round. Never had a problem.

If I was to dive cold water I would switch to a diaphragm reg like Posiedon xstream's.

 

[Hatul]

I highly doubt 2nd stage corrosion is about the seat saver. The seat saver let water into the LP hose. If you have corrosion in 1st stage, seat saver can still be one of the reasons. All 2nd stages, seat saver or not, the inside is wet when submerg.

But, isn't 99.999% of regulators ever made today are chrome brass? If this material has issue, then all regulators will have issue by now. I think the main cost of corrosion is still user error.

What I meant is that with the seat saver the diver is reluctant to soak the regulator like you usually do, and a quick rinse may not wash away all the salt.

 

[beanojones]

The original piston was never Ti, it was stainless steel. The T1x I picked up has the original "sharp" piston. When updating to the jet seat piston I installed the monel piston instead of the stainless piston. The monel piston was not that much more and given that the gas flow across the edge is potential hot spot I figured I would hedge my bets.


Except that the spring is stainless steel. Which sealing will protect. If a monel piston well that is what it is suppose to do - be highly corrosion resistant. BTW most people think stainless steel will not rust. It can.

well I got both of those wrong then. Both the original piston and the spring were Stainless not Titanium? Color me stupid.

Well no wonder they had to go with sealing the chamber. Because as you say, stainless means rusts a little slower than chromed brass.

---------- Post added July 3rd, 2013 at 01:46 AM ----------

I highly doubt 2nd stage corrosion is about the seat saver. The seat saver let water into the LP hose. If you have corrosion in 1st stage, seat saver can still be one of the reasons. All 2nd stages, seat saver or not, the inside is wet when submerg.

But, isn't 99.999% of regulators ever made today are chrome brass? If this material has issue, then all regulators will have issue by now. I think the main cost of corrosion is still user error.

Or just living in the tropics where the air itself is salty.

The Titanium second stage simply does not need any care. All other second stages corrode even with care. After retiring my umpteenth g250, I switched to Atomic titanium second stages and never looked back. (Although the plastic bits seem to be made of compressed paper sometimes.)

I have retired a couple of Zirconium second stages I got thinking they would last better than chromed brass. They did not.