Argon? I have the gas but is it worth the trouble?

[David P]

this same discussion is going on at another site... Ill give my 1/2cent worth. I setup a redundant DS inflation system. Always just used air, then one day I got a 50% argon fill. I go out diving, helping a buddy (first time in a drysuit, or doubles, cant remember which) anyhow, I was preoccupied and didn't pay much attention to my warmth. After everything calmed down I remembered the argon, I gave a little squirt and I swear I felt the incoming gas was warmer than air. I was so damn happy, as all the money spent on the inflation system was worth it! Full disclosure: I am diving So Cal ~50 in a trilam suit with a polartec 100 undergarment, so I get understandable cool. Recently I got a chance to get a 100% argon fill. I went diving and dont you know, it felt like air to me. I was under water wondering if I didn't just get charged for argon and they filled the tank with air... I am seriously looking at new undies, I think they will make a much larger improvement in my comfort level. However, even if argon is a placebo, and the thermal improvement is all mental, who cares!?!? if your feel warmer, you feel warmer. Maybe brushing with CloseUp instead of Crest will make you feel warmer?

 

[DA Aquamaster]

I agree that you have a choice in extant research:
A few small studies that have small populations and have for the most part not been replicated.

On the other hand you have what amounts to a random aggregation of hundreds of case studies invoving hundreds of divers with thousands of dives. The protocols of all these individual case studies are no where near consistent, but with the large number of them taken together, the confounding variables tend to level out and you get a pretty good random sampling effect occurring in terms of the effectiveness of argon across a wide variation in procedures, insulating undergarments, water temps and dive times.

And the consensus is argon does not make any significant difference for the average diver using it in real world settings.

It would be worth doing a properly designed scientific study with a double blind experimental design in standardized conditions with as much control as possible with a large sample of divers of various physical builds, from the same climate and with similar dive experience doing identical dive profiles in identical water temp/air temp/sunlight conditions with identical drysuit and underwear combinations.

It would also be worth following this up with research on the psychological/placebo effects of argon as well as research to determine the best operational practices for using argon and the impact of lowering the rigor of those procedures to more real world levels to determine the most beneficial and optimum procedures in terms of cost, time and benefit to use with argon.

All of the above would give you a more complete picture of the factors that impact the effectiveness of argon compared to air. In the end it would most likely give you valid data to support the body of non scientific case study evidence that proposes that argon use is not significantly more effective than air - which is problematic as no one, other than perhaps a well funded doctoral candidate wants to waste time and money empirically proving what many people already suspect.

 

[wedivebc]

Weinberg. Alternate drysuit inflation gas for improved thermal protection. In: Proceedings of the DCIEM Diver Thermal Protection Workshop, Defence and Civil Institute of Environmental Medicine, Toronto, CA, 31 Jan-2 Feb 1989. Edited by RY Nishi, Workshop Chairmen TT Romet and JA Sterba. RRR ID: 3922

.

I know a guy who was a lab rat for that study. As they sat in icy water with probes coming out of every orifice one of the scientist, holding up a rectal probe commented "Anyone seen my pen?"

 

[Teamcasa]

Here is my quick and dirty calculation. To me it is obvious that insulation thickness is way more important than the gas (not counting He as we know He is not good at all). But it appears there is a small benefit approx. 15% using Ar over Air.

Scott

Thanks Scott, Your calculations seem to bear out what many are saying. My conclusion is that there is some improvement in warmth, but since the change is so slight, many simply do not notice it.

I agree that the undergarment makes up the significant portion of thermal protection and the gas plays a very minor roll. (Assuming recreational diving conditions, on Air or Nitrox in SoCal waters.) All I need is a 6cu cylinder to try it but I think I’ll try Air first and see how it goes.

 

[SlowRain]

Tried it. In my mind the cost/benefit wasn't there. If you don't mind spending the money and feel it makes a difference...then go for it. Personally I don't use argon.

 

[limeyx]

I agree that the undergarment makes up the significant portion of thermal protection and the gas plays a very minor roll. (Assuming recreational diving conditions, on Air or Nitrox in SoCal waters.) All I need is a 6cu cylinder to try it but I think I’ll try Air first and see how it goes.

In SoCal, very few "need" Ar. If you need warmth, the cheapest fixes are

- 12 mm hood from otter bay
- dry gloves

followed by undergarments.

if you dive He, get an Ar bottle and use air. If not, you dont need an Ar bottle.

My experience (and that of most others i dive with)

if the Ar is free & easy, cannot help but I never noticed a different in SoCal with it, but I do use it for good measure in Seattle if I can get it.