Are you a DIR-like Diver?

Are you a DIR or DIR-like Diver?

  • 100% DIR

    Votes: 4 4.7%
  • working towards 100% DIR

    Votes: 17 19.8%
  • Partially DIR no intent to continue to 100%

    Votes: 20 23.3%
  • Hogarthian

    Votes: 18 20.9%
  • none of the above

    Votes: 27 31.4%

  • Total voters
    86
  • Poll closed .

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Saturation

Medical Moderator
Messages
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Location
Philadelphia, PA
# of dives
2500 - 4999
This was a running thread on TDS but their editors do not allow polls.

The questions should hopefully be self explanatory.

DIR is defined by J. Jablonski in his book "Doing It Right: The Fundamentals of Better Diving." If your gear configuration and dive skills are as JJ or George Irvine mandate, you are 100% DIR.

Any variant of it is not 100% DIR, including 99% of its preachings.

Please select what you think is your diving style.
 
I am not DIR and have no desire to take one of their seminars/classes/coures or whatever they are tomorrow.

I have excellent bouyancy control.

I have excellent swimming abilities

I have excellent emergency handling capabilities

I don't dive with the long hose.

I practice all of the above often.

I dive with a jacket style BC 80% of the time

So I guess I have some DIR likenesses But when it comes to bouyancy, emergency drills, practicing. Then I'm like PADI, NAUI, SSI, YMCA, CMAS, MDEA, and a few others also.
 
I'm with Cincy on this one.
If I think it's needed then I do it, or buy it. I do consider myself a conservetive/organised diver BTW.
Some folks seem to get all caught up in the mental "how to do it right" kinda mentality.
That's fine for them, but not for me. to each thier own. If I am so worried that I loook right, or if I am doing it Right, then it takes away from the prime directive.... enjoy thyself. (without harming the enviromment that is)
 
Saturation once bubbled...
This was a running thread on TDS but their editors do not allow polls.

The questions should hopefully be self explanatory.

DIR is defined by J. Jablonski in his book "Doing It Right: The Fundamentals of Better Diving." If your gear configuration and dive skills are as JJ or George Irvine mandate, you are 100% DIR.

Any variant of it is not 100% DIR, including 99% of its preachings.

Please select what you think is your diving style.
I adopted some things from cave and wreck divers but I would be insulted and embarassed if someone thought I was DIR. I'm a nice guy, and therefore I can never be DIR.

I have really mixed feelings about DIR. On the one hand, the best practices appeal to me but on the other hand I have the following prevailing feeling about DIR (cynic mode = on):

You can't become DIR by buying equipment (what you suggest) and you can't become DIR by any other means either as long as you're still human.

And I will add this to what Phillip said:

Nothing DIR is original.

Buoyancy skills are not DIR.

Long hoses and bungied octos are not DIR. That was already a best practice when JJ's mother was still telling him when to come home after school.

Diving in Buddy teams is not DIR.

The magic DIR/GUE on-the-fly deco calculations are not DIR. The US navy was alreay doing this in the 1950's.

And further

Black is not DIR.

Cool is not DIR.

Fun is most definitely not DIR.

Even JJ isn't DIR. He was PADI before he got sucked into the dark side.

And social skills are obviously not DIR.

so what *IS* DIR then.... :
- arrogance is DIR
- re-writing history is DIR
- conflicts of (business) interests is DIR
- cover ups and misinformation regarding accidents is DIR
- burning bridges with the founders and genuinely creative and innovative souls behind the system is DIR
- Bickering is DIR
- Cynicism is DIR (but clearly not *only* DIR :))
- George Irvine's hate mail is DIR
- Keeping the faith even it means calling past friends "stroke" is DIR
- Lack of respect is DIR
- Losing respect is DIR

and finally

- Alienation from the rest of the diving world is DIR.

Bring it on.

R..
 
Diver0001 once bubbled...

I adopted some things from cave and wreck divers but I would be insulted and embarassed if someone thought I was DIR. I'm a nice guy, and therefore I can never be DIR.

I have really mixed feelings about DIR. On the one hand, the best practices appeal to me but on the other hand I have the following prevailing feeling about DIR (cynic mode = on):

You can't become DIR by buying equipment (what you suggest) and you can't become DIR by any other means either as long as you're still human.

And I will add this to what Phillip said:

Nothing DIR is original.

Buoyancy skills are not DIR.

Long hoses and bungied octos are not DIR. That was already a best practice when JJ's mother was still telling him when to come home after school.

Diving in Buddy teams is not DIR.

The magic DIR/GUE on-the-fly deco calculations are not DIR. The US navy was alreay doing this in the 1950's.

And further

Black is not DIR.

Cool is not DIR.

Fun is most definitely not DIR.

Even JJ isn't DIR. He was PADI before he got sucked into the dark side.

And social skills are obviously not DIR.

so what *IS* DIR then.... :
- arrogance is DIR
- re-writing history is DIR
- conflicts of (business) interests is DIR
- cover ups and misinformation regarding accidents is DIR
- burning bridges with the founders and genuinely creative and innovative souls behind the system is DIR
- Bickering is DIR
- Cynicism is DIR (but clearly not *only* DIR :))
- George Irvine's hate mail is DIR
- Keeping the faith even it means calling past friends "stroke" is DIR
- Lack of respect is DIR
- Losing respect is DIR

and finally

- Alienation from the rest of the diving world is DIR.

Bring it on.

R..

DAMN...I didn't want to say it but......................:D
 
I'm Not DIR and happy about it ...

No problem folks. I'm just polling how many true DIR divers there are, at least within SB.

The same question was asked at the DIR Forum of TDS but in individual posts, which is a pain to collate.

However, DIR also includes non-technical issues, and the 17,000 SB members offers a potential base for an interesting reply, as you all have done.
 
Hold on....I see no mention of a tall frosty glass of freshly brewed kool-aid anywhere.....haven't we beaten this issue dead many times over anyway?

Not so much the "am I or not"...but the "what is/isn't"....just one time I'd like to see it (the topic of discussion) stay remotely on course....
 
Big-t-2538 once bubbled...
Hold on....I see no mention of a tall frosty glass of freshly brewed kool-aid anywhere.....haven't we beaten this issue dead many times over anyway?

Not so much the "am I or not"...but the "what is/isn't"....just one time I'd like to see it (the topic of discussion) stay remotely on course....


This is remotely on course compared to the other threads we've been a part of lately.:) :D
 
Diver0001 once bubbled...

I adopted some things from cave and wreck divers but I would be insulted and embarassed if someone thought I was DIR.

I thought you were DIR. I'm sorry if that offends you. Please understand that from this perspective, it's quite a compliment.


I'm a nice guy, and therefore I can never be DIR.

Now, I find that insulting.

I'm sorry, but I simply don't agree with the notion that DIR = "not a nice guy." Apparently, your experiences with DIR guys and my experiences with DIR guys has been quite different.


Even JJ isn't DIR. He was PADI before he got sucked into the dark side.

GUE is not a certifying agency. Of course, you know this... But my point is that every diver who is DIR (or is headed towards DIR) was first PADI, NAUI, YMCA, SSI, etc. Having been trained by these agencies does not somehow make you "un" DIR. They compliment GUE training nicely, in fact.


And social skills are obviously not DIR.

I beg your pardon. :eek:

I fear that the people who you have talked to who CLAIM to be DIR might not have been the best example of DIR. :D


so what *IS* DIR then.... :
- arrogance is DIR
- re-writing history is DIR
- conflicts of (business) interests is DIR
- cover ups and misinformation regarding accidents is DIR
- burning bridges with the founders and genuinely creative and innovative souls behind the system is DIR
- Bickering is DIR
- Cynicism is DIR (but clearly not *only* DIR :))
- George Irvine's hate mail is DIR
- Keeping the faith even it means calling past friends "stroke" is DIR
- Lack of respect is DIR
- Losing respect is DIR

and finally

- Alienation from the rest of the diving world is DIR.

Bring it on.

R..

*Ahem*

I will point out, R, that you seem to have taken on a rather aggressive side against DIR, and without provocation. I suggest that you reassess that list above and consider who, exactly, it is that demonstrates those traits most clearly.

...I'd also like to point out that George Irvine is not affiliated with GUE and is not a DIR instructor. His attitude is not typical of other DIR divers. In fact, many "higher ups" in GUE and George don't get along well.

FWIW, I voted "working towards 100% DIR." While I don't dive any way or any thing that's NOT DIR, I feel that my fitness program could use some work and would prefer to consider my "DIR-ness" a work in progress. To me, the success in anything I do is more of a journey than a destination. So... It simply felt right to not vote as "100% DIR." It's my bet that the best in the dive industry would say the same.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have to go pull together the next few dives for our dive club... You know, so that we can all dive alienated together. :)

FWIW, at this point I, too, would be insulted and embarrassed if someone thought you were DIR. :D
 
Saturation once bubbled...
.....DIR is defined by J. Jablonski in his book "Doing It Right: The Fundamentals of Better Diving." If your gear configuration and dive skills are as JJ or George Irvine mandate, you are 100% DIR.

Any variant of it is not 100% DIR, including 99% of its preachings.


For those who missed it, I will re-post the comments from "The Man Himself" in response to JJ as follows:

For many years, I have watched--without responding--as some people have rewritten cave diving history to support their personal agendas. And for those many years, I have generally been amused by "facts" that are inaccurate and by events that never actually occurred. However, Jarrod's article demands a response from me, so I am making my first ever Internet posting. I feel compelled to make this response for two primary reasons.

First, Jarrod uses the words "twisted facts" in his post, when, in fact, several of his own "facts" are inaccurate. Second, I spoke to Jarrod recently and told him I was going to write an article regarding the differences between the Hogarthian configuration and DIR. When Jarrod heard this news, he became defensive and asked me not to write the article because it "would stir things up." So I complied with his request and did not write the article. If, however, I wrote the article now, there are several things I might say.

For example, I might mention that Lloyd Bailey, my long time friend, certified Jarrod in full cave on October 23, 1989, a date that's after some of the events about which Jarrod writes with seeming authority. In actuality, Jarrod was not there in the early days of the WKPP, nor was anyone else currently in that organization around in those days. In my non-article, I also might write an interesting tidbit to put some perspective on Jarrod's position in the equation. Specifically, when Jarrod was working at Ginnie Springs, we used to dive a lot together. One night, while we were decompressing on the log in Devil's Ear, I used my slate to ask Jarrod in what year he was born. When he wrote his response, I realized that I had been decompressing on what seemed to be the same log when he was only three years old. As a result, the cave diving history on which Jarrod reports is frequently nothing more than hearsay. Inasmuch as this is the case, I'd like to correct the most glaring errors Jarrod makes in his posting.

Specifically, Sheck Exley died before the term "DIR" was used. Furthermore, in the beginning of DIR, the basic configuration was the same as Hogarthian, although differences did come into play later. As far as the coining of the term "Hogarthian configuration" is concerned, the mastermind of those words was John Zumrick and not Bill Gavin. And, finally, the main theme of the original WKPP members was of minimalism and the complete elimination of danglies. The poor gear configuration of which Jarrod writes in his post was definitely not characteristic of the initial WKPP group, and again, Jarrod wasn't around to even witness what our gear configuration was.

In closing, Jarrod has been a part of some big events in cave diving and has made some incredible dives. However, I have always believed that if you must report on or write about parts of cave diving history, you will make fewer mistakes if you were there. William Hogarth Main
 
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