Are weight belts dangerous?

[O2BBubbleFree]

The DUI harness solves just about all issues with weight belts IMO (I dive one, so I am of course biased).

However, it also introduces a problem given that you can not remove the system easily to while in the water without getting out of the rest of your gear first. This would be a problem if using a dive kayak for instance.

Harness systems are still vastly superior to belts IMO.

Just my $0.02

But couldn't you just take the weights out? Why would you need to remove the harness?

 

[Chad Carney]

LOL nice, that'll teach me. I see it actually comes from LeisurePro.

I actually did some searching on the net and came across a spearfishing board that pointed me to a shop in Austin that has that one plus a similar one for less:

http://www.austinsdiving.com/weightbelts/

It's somewhat tempting to pick one up, put the slide-on pockets from my XS pocket belt on it and see how it does.

CDude,

You found a great store!

But Austin's is a serious freedive and scuba store in Miami Florida.

Last I checked they had Omer, Sporasub, Rob Allen and more when it came to Marseilles style weight belts. We (Zeagle) chose the high quality Rob Allen weight belt and adapted it with removeable stainless steel bolts so weights could be added or removed from both ends of the belt. Austin's should have Zeagle's new belt any day.

Call Dennis and he will get you a great weight belt.

Chad

 

[beejw]

Where did you come up with this gem?

do you really think companies wouldnt cover there @$$'s. if a buckle was to fail leading to an injury, and the buckle failure was deemed the reason, it leaves the door open for an investigation into a possibly unsafe product, which in turn could lead to the company losing money. tis common sense.

 

[Halthron]

We’re talking about the waist strap of the harness (not the tank strap on your back) being potentially confused, esp. when where mitts, with the weight belt buckle.

That makes more sense but that's not what was said. The quote of you said tank strap. Personally, those rare times when I do wear a weight belt, I move the buckle far to one side (left thip) to avoid that exact confusion. This is also another argument for the use of the hog harness. When I undo my waist strap, the BC still isn't going anywhere easily so if I (or a rescuer) did undo it, the BC would shiftf a bit but mostly stay where it ought to.

Everything comes down to “training,” and I’ll address that later.

<bunch of stuff snipped>
Seems like an attempt at using gear to fix training/teamwork issues. If someone doesn't have the skills, frame of mind or the buddy team to fix the problem, gear is a partial solution that will work to resolve a symptom but won't fix the problem which is poor preparation.

 

[Thalassamania]

Seems like an attempt at using gear to fix training/teamwork issues.

Exactly, anytime that a simple change in a piece of gear can resolve a potential training or teamwork issue it should be seriously considered, that's what THINKING diving is about. As George said in answer to a similar question, "Only a complete and utter stroke would do it any other way.”<G>

This comes down to training, comfort and environment. This can certainly be true in shallow water but it's less true the deeper you go. Once past 15 feet or so, I've never had a problem. Of course, it's best to find a place where the BC can rest on the ground while you're fiddling with it but if you're in open water the key is to stay deep enough so that the weight of the water makes it easier to keep you down and to put a bit of air in the BC to make it more buoyant. I've done gear removal and troubleshooting at 50 feet with another 30-40 feet of water below me without a problem.

As you noted, “This can certainly be true in shallow water.” I’ll agree with what you are saying for warm water diving with minimal neoprene, but that does not obviate the need to address potential shallow water problems (you can't breathe shallow water any better than you can deep water), nor have you addressed diving with a 7 mil suit made of Rubetex or with a dry suit.

do you really think companies wouldnt cover there @$$'s. if a buckle was to fail leading to an injury, and the buckle failure was deemed the reason, it leaves the door open for an investigation into a possibly unsafe product, which in turn could lead to the company losing money. tis common sense.

There are any number of accidents that I've looked at where I suspected that a contributing cause was the failure of a weightbelt buckle, but since the body was recovered without a belt it is always assumed that the diver ditched it.

 

[rockhound13]

But couldn't you just take the weights out? Why would you need to remove the harness?

You could, but then the weights would be loose if you took them out of the pockets. The pockets are ditchable, but you have to rethread the pockets back onto the vest, ripcord style. Not a good option for donning or doffing a bc in the water when your "x" pounds heavy and no bc, glub, glub!!!

 

[Halthron]

Exactly, anytime that a simple change in a piece of gear can resolve a potential training or teamwork issue it should be seriously considered, that's what THINKING diving is about. As George said in answer to a similar question, "Only a complete and utter stroke would do it any other way.”<G>

Fixing a skills problem with gear is not a good long term solution. I'll agree only if that's changed to that it should be considered as a temporary solution while the diver actively works on improving the subpar skills that caused the problem in the first place. To paraphrase:

"A superior diver is one who uses superior judgement to avoid using their superior skills."

There's no mention of "superior gear".

 

[Thalassamania]

Fixing a skills problem with gear is not a good long term solution. I'll agree only if that's changed to that it should be considered as a temporary solution while the diver actively works on improving the subpar skills that caused the problem in the first place. To paraphrase:

"A superior diver is one who uses superior judgement to avoid using their superior skills."

There's no mention of "superior gear".

Every time you select a piece of gear you are "fixing a skills problem" and that will be the case until you learn to extract oxygen from the water itself using no hardware whatsoever.

You select an optimum piece of equipment for the task so that you minimize the risks you take in the environment that you operate in. "Superior judgment" must be applied to many things, including the selection of equipment and the way in which it is to be used.

The woman who was caught in the net in the story I related earlier was one of our stronger freedivers. I&#8217;ve seen her freedive well past 100 feet and during breath hold exercises she often exceeded three minutes (I had to talk to her about not pushing it any further). Would she have died in the net? Not likely. But she was in a very uncomfortable position that, without assistance, might well have killed a lesser diver.

She kept her head and was working on the problem when I arrived. One of the things that kept her calm (and her SAC rate down) was the fact that she knew if she had to bail she had what it takes to make it to the surface. But had she had all her ballast off her body, I don't know that she, or for that matter anyone, could have kept themself from fouling in the net that was over her head.

Was that a "buddy failure?" I'd say that yes it was, but though I'm about the strongest buddy and team advocate that you'll ever find, I'd not put all my eggs in the buddy basket either.

I feel strongly that a diver should be trimmed for 15 feet with no rig and that the rig should be trimmed for 15 feet, dead empty (use the BP/w or BC to bring the rig to neutral when it&#8217;s holding gas).

 

[shoredivr]

Part of the "buckle coming undone" problem can also be solved by having two buckles on the same belt (one stainless steel, one plastic for those concerned about the plastic one breaking).

I agree with Thalassamania's point that having no ballast (ie weight-integrated systems) is not a good thing if you had to take your tank off for whatever reason. Especially true with deco diving. Really don't want to be positively buoyant.....