No, they should know enough to realise what they AREN'T capable or comfortable of. And constantly be assessing that every minute of every dive to avoid a bad situation.
No it doesn't. Yet again you're confusing recommendations for rules. It says you shouldn't do it without training. However at the end of the day if you want to you can. There are no police, no locked doors, if you think you are comfortable doing it after weighing up the risks you can do whatever you like.
And you're confusing the word "forbid" for "illegal" or "impossible". Look at the meaning of the word "forbid". It has nothing to do with police or locked doors. From Oxford (
http://www.askoxford.com/concise_oed/forbid?view=uk): forbid:1 refuse to allow. 2 order not to do.
From PADI's OW book "until you have thye training and equipment you need do not enter a cavern, cave, wreck or any other overhead environment". They never say it's enforcable, but they are forbidding you to do it.
I havent met a single diver in my life that hasn't broken some/many/all of his training guidelines at some point in their life. If there are millions of these "perfect" divers around ive never met one of them.
Where did I talk about perfect divers? I'm talking about your point that people should know what they're capable of while also saying their training is incorrect. I'd love it if I had some sort of Spider-Sense or something where I just knew if something was a good or bad idea, but it takes more than that. And so far the only thing I've learned about overhead environments is that they are unsafe if not trained. If that is incorrect, then really I have nothing to go by to decide underwater if I should follow your or not.
Maybe after researching a bit more I realize that I would be safe, but at this point all I know is what I've been taught, and if that is incorrect, I am in no position to make a decision.
That's a personal view and nothing more. If you arent confident in your buddys skills and equally arent confident in your own skills to get your buddy out then dont do it. Its common sense. Not every diver is incapable of self or other rescue though.
You may think you do but you dont. Also a guide has to represent the whole group not one individual. Chances are every other person in that group would have wanted that dive so who do you please - the majority or the 1 guy that isnt skilled enough and who didnt tell you beforehand?
It's not about confidence. I may be entirely confident that I could successfully take an OW trained diver to 100 feet if I'm AOW certified. But I still probably wouldn't do it, at the very least I wouldn't encourage it. If I explained to my buddy that this probably isn't a great idea and he insists, then maybe we go to 100 feet.
Just like I probably figure I could take a non-trained diver with me and we'd probably be safe. I may be entirely confident in this, the other person may be entirely confident in me. But instead of doing this, I'll say "take an OW course"
You can't "unexpectedly" find yourself in an overhead. Nobody forces you in kicking and screaming. As to why dive briefings dont always work - its usually because the divers themselves pay little or no attention to them, are fiddling with kit, talking to the person next to them or thinking they've heard it all before so wont bother. That also isnt the divemasters fault.
I was talking about unexpectedly finding yourself in a position where you need to decide to break away from the group or enter an overhead.
And yes, of course if divers don't listen to the brief there is some/all the responsibility on their shoulders (depending on the exact situation).
