Are backplates and wings not for noobs?

[divestoclimb]

*sigh* not wanting to read through pages of weight flame, has anyone mentioned this yet?

A BP/W can theoretically be used for OW but it depends greatly on who the instructor is whether or not it will work out. You should ask the instructor you'll be taking the class from whether or not it's okay.

 

[Reg Braithwaite]

Yes well Sparticle Brain your kind of bull is to be expected thats that DIR philosophy and attitude we often see which as we all know is a bunch of bull s..t when trying to push it on recreational divers.

To the best of my knowledge, Sparticle is not speaking for DIR. DIR has a certain philosophy around the maximum amount of risk a DIR team will tolerate when diving, which leads to a number of conclusions about gear choices, fitness, and skill proficiency.

I have JJ's introductory book, where he talks about taking DIR concepts to recreational diving, and he describes it as helping people have more fun and helping people be more comfortable while being safer. I did not read anything saying that people making choices he considers sub-optimal should not dive, just that they would have more fun, be more comfortable, and be safer if they went DIR.

Now, DIR is very specific about DIR divers not diving with people who willingly impose additional and unnecessary risk on the team by making other choices. I think that's a valid point: A team is only as strong as its weakest diver. But I have read nothing official from JJ or GUE suggesting the oceans be purged of people who do not dive DIR.

We could take this over to the DIR forum if you are interested in hearing what DIR practitioners have to say on the subject of official DIR as opposed to a personal opinion from someone diving DIR. I certainly don't speak for DIR.

 

[cool_hardware52]

*sigh* not wanting to read through pages of weight flame, has anyone mentioned this yet?

A BP/W can theoretically be used for OW but it depends greatly on who the instructor is whether or not it will work out. You should ask the instructor you'll be taking the class from whether or not it's okay.

Humm, yes it was mentioned, say about POST # 4

I'd suggest you speak with your instructor. He / she is ultimately going to have to be comfortable with what you use during training. You can of course look for an instructor who is familiar with BP&W's

Tobin

 

[divestoclimb]

Oops sorry Tobin, I saw that post but didn't catch that part of it...

 

[TSandM]

Then I'm pretty sure I'm not going to be able to sign the form because it is quite literally impossible for a person who is 440lbs to present without detectable cardiovascular disease and/or a metabolic disorder - impaired glucose tolerance if not frank diabetes

This is not true. Although morbid obesity is a significant risk factor for metabolic syndrome and for hypertension and cardiac disease, there are morbidly obese people (particularly young ones) who do not have any significant amount of any of those problems.

Has anybody looked at this guy's picture? He's young, and he's obese, but not nearly to the degree that one would think from reading "440 lbs". He's a BIG guy.

I deplore obesity, and as a physician, I'm more than well aware of the health consequences of it, but making blanket statements like the above benefits no one. If Big Tim is motivated to lose weight by the prospect of diving, that's a very positive thing. Perhaps diving will be a whole lifestyle changer for him!

Yes well Sparticle Brain your kind of bull is to be expected thats that DIR philosophy and attitude we often see which as we all know is a bunch of bull s..t when trying to push it on recreational divers.

Sparticle's opinion is his own, is not representative of any group of people.

 

[divestoclimb]

Ask a few questions on SB, read some books, buy some software, "immerse" yourself in the subject of decompression and human physiology, then you will be able to decide whether and how to dive based on facts.

Your risk of decompression sickness may be increased (hard to say for sure) but you should not have to get into the science of it for basic recreational diving. In an OW class you'll be taught how to determine how long you can stay at a given depth while still being able to ascend directly with minimal risk, according to a dive table. In your case, you may find it prudent to stay on the conservative side of the number that the tables tell you. If the table says you can stay 25 minutes at 100 feet, maybe you should only stay for 20 minutes. The more advanced theory is only needed for the more advanced diving that some of us on this board do.

 

[SparticleBrane]

Yes well Sparticle Brain your kind of bull is to be expected thats that DIR philosophy and attitude we often see which as we all know is a bunch of bull s..t when trying to push it on recreational divers.

My opinion is my own and has nothing to do with DIR.

 

[rstofer]

You know what? You are PAYING to take the OW class. Get the BP/W, get it adjusted to fit and just show up with it. You are the customer, end of discussion. If the instructor is incapable of teaching you to dive just because you have a BP/W, get another instructor. There are literally THOUSANDS of instructors. Far more than the sport could ever use. Someone will be qualified, capable and willing.

In fact, consider taking the class privately or with just your dad. Sure, it will cost a little more but the training will be more individualized. Classes for juniors are frequently one-on-one and the cost is $400 versus about $170. It's more but, in SCUBA dollars, insignificant.

A 'boat buck' describes the monetary unit when messing about with boats. It's actual dollar value is $1000. So, if you spent 5 'boat bucks' on maintenance this year, it was really $5000. It's the same kind of thing with SCUBA dollars but it probably converts in units of $100. So, a private course is 4 SCUBA dollars versus 2 SCUBA dollars for the conventional approach. We use these virtual units to keep from crying about the real cost!

Consider doing the checkout dives from a boat. Sure, most courses probably include beach entries and boat dives may cost more but who cares? You are the customer! The instructor needs to make it work for you. Even if you have to charter a 6 pack boat for a couple of days, who cares? Organize your training to fit your needs.

You do not have to apologize for anything when you are the customer! Things are what they are. Go for it!

Richard

 

[David_57]

To the best of my knowledge, Sparticle is not speaking for DIR. DIR has a certain philosophy around the maximum amount of risk a DIR team will tolerate when diving, which leads to a number of conclusions about gear choices, fitness, and skill proficiency.

I have JJ's introductory book, where he talks about taking DIR concepts to recreational diving, and he describes it as helping people have more fun and helping people be more comfortable while being safer. I did not read anything saying that people making choices he considers sub-optimal should not dive, just that they would have more fun, be more comfortable, and be safer if they went DIR.

Now, DIR is very specific about DIR divers not diving with people who willingly impose additional and unnecessary risk on the team by making other choices. I think that's a valid point: A team is only as strong as its weakest diver. But I have read nothing official from JJ or GUE suggesting the oceans be purged of people who do not dive DIR.

We could take this over to the DIR forum if you are interested in hearing what DIR practitioners have to say on the subject of official DIR as opposed to a personal opinion from someone diving DIR. I certainly don't speak for DIR.

Absolutely not interested in DIR, hell will freeze over before I would waste my time reading anything to do with GUE/DIR, I am quite happy with TDI thanks.

 

[rstofer]

Absolutely not interested in DIR, hell will freeze over before I would waste my time reading anything to do with GUE/DIR, I am quite happy with TDI thanks.

I guess I could do without the attitude that they won't dive with me because I am unworthy. But we're all free to choose who we dive with. Including them...

The GUE divers in the "Essentials" video are the best I have ever seen. Those fellows know how to dive! I am in awe...

I also think they have some great gear configuration ideas. I will never dive deep, caves or wreck penetration. I'm just too old for that kind of thing. So, I will pick and choose the ideas that best serve my needs.

I am planning to have my grandson take the GUE courses as soon as he is old enough. He doesn't need to become an evangelist but it would be good to be exposed to their concepts. Maybe he will learn to dive as well as the "Essentials" fellows. That would be terrific!

Richard