Most of the rescues ive done are paniced divers in 30 feet.
Well there ya go then ... you don't need AOW to deal with someone at 30 feet ... and a Rescue class will train someone how to deal with a panicked diver. AOW will not. So why shouldn't we put safety first and train people from the outset how to deal with these problems. It might save their bacon once they start diving in more challenging conditions.
I mean again its all up to the diver i mean padi and these other certifications give there requirments but its up to the instructor and the store.
Stores are in business to make money ... it's sometimes an inherent conflict of interest with respect to what's best for the student.
Also i highly doubt in your OW course you get the students to perform squares, directional paterns, and ppb in different levels of water with different exercises ie hula hoops, decent hovers and so on. . . I could be wrong i suppose?
No ... you'd be right ... I don't do those things in OW. Nor do I understand what relevence they have to training someone to self-rescue ... or to help someone else. What I do cover in OW is rescue tows, basic navigation, and how to bring an unconscious diver up from the bottom in approximately 20 feet of water. Those are mandated by my agency, and I believe they are essential skills that should be taught at the OW level.
At the Rescue level, we cover basic search patterns ... contour (using constant depth), parallel (using constant heading), circular and semi-circular (using a reel). These rescue skills build upon what was learned in OW. AOW skills are not necessary to teach Rescue ... they are needed for diving in more challenging environments. These are two completely different types of classes, and there is little to no overlap in the skills needed in one to build upon the other. And to my concern, Rescue is the more important of the two to train the diver in sooner.
Who's to say that if the diver in this incident we're discussing had Rescue skills, he might have avoided being dead right now? Knowing how to deal with a situation greatly reduces the tendency of divers to panic ... a panicked diver is someone who is faced with a problem they see no rational way to deal with ... panic is the mind's irrational response to that situation. Rescue class trains a diver how to deal with problems ... and more importantly, how to recognize the onset of a situation that's going to lead to a problem, so they can take action to prevent the accident from happening in the first place. I'm firmly in favor of providing divers these tool as soon after their basic certification as possible.
I dont think someone with 4 ow dives is able to either, and id trust task loading a AOW more then an OW.
It depends on the diver ... but I'd trust someone with OW and Rescue to be far more capable of making better decisions for either self-rescuing or helping another diver than I would someone who's only OW and AOW ... because the latter has never been trained how to deal with a problem situation. It boils down to which tools the diver will find more useful in a crisis ... those covered in Rescue or those covered in AOW. I'm sure the AOW diver could probably navigate a better square, or swim more smoothly though a hula hoop ... I just don't see how that'd be more useful in an emergency.
Telling people they need 50 dives before they can take anymore courses is overkill! diving is adult education
I don't tell my students how many dives they need between classes ... I tell them what level of skill and comfort I expect them to have before class begins ... in most cases I go diving with them and evaluate where they're at, and if needed I will tell them what they need to work on before we begin. I do that because I want my students to get the most value for their money ... and they can best accomplish that by being prepared to focus on the goals of the class.
diving is adult education, you get told the risks and you get told the requirments and its up to the adult student to decide if there ready and the instructor to monitor them through out!
How would someone who's never done something ... who has no idea what doing that something involves ... be able to decide if they're ready? On what criteria would they base that decision?
There is a big difference between telling someone the risks and teaching them how to deal with those risks. The instructor is the best person to know whether or not a student is adequately prepared to achieve the class objectives. I don't "monitor" my students ... I train them. It's an interactive process ... and one that is best achieved when students come to class adequately prepared.
... Bob (Grateful Diver)
Asking as a non-rescue certified diver, would it not have been a possiblity, given the diver falling back down, to descend, get the diver back on air, and try to release weight on the bottom before trying to bring the diver to the surface again?
