aow lights

[tbone1004]

@Rred Princeton Tec's only competitive light on the market is the Genesis which is the same light as the Cave Adventurers Explorer and HOG Morph 1000 except it uses CR123 batteries instead of rechargeable 18650's. 98% sure it can use 18650's, but that's an extra expense hassle vs. the other two. None of their other lights are competitive, so not sure where you are coming from with that. In terms of cost:lumens:burn time, they don't have anything close.

your comment on using alkaline cells is also hilarious. There is absolutely no need to use alkaline cells anymore in dive lights. Their burntime:cost ratio doesn't make sense, neither does their burntime:size ratio compared to 18650's, and to further complicate things, something that runs on c cells is utterly massive and can't easily be put in a soft goodman handle, but on top of that you have the added weight and bulk when travelling. That's a horrible recommendation... It was one thing when comparing to NiMH batteries, but with 3400mah 18650's on the market at reasonable prices, there is no point in purchasing alkaline battery powered primary lights anymore, and really alkaline powered lights in general

 

[Rred]

tbone-
Alkaline batteries will be plenty good enough for someone who is using dive lights just once--for their AOW checkout--and has no plans for regular use beyond that. Which was the OP's situation.
If you want to talk about ridiculous, let's talk about 18650 batteries. I checked with Ultrafire a couple of years ago, and according to them, EVERY vendor selling "Ultrafire" 18650's on ebay and Amazon was selling counterfeits. Not just some of the vendors--but every one of them.
Try to find a vendor that is really selling what they claim to be selling. Even when the "vendor" is a respected domestic company, they may jut be contracting out bids, and not really knowing what they got until they get complaints about it.
Or, even if they KNOW they are buying the best of goods...
Dell, Sony, HP, Apple, Samsung...all have had lithium battery fires and explosions. All respected brand names, and yes, some of those have been 18650's. then there's the extra cost of lithium batteries and rechargers.

Alkaline cells? For someone who isn't planning heavy use of the light, one set can last all year. Much cheaper, simpler, and they never catch fire while you are sleeping. Yes, I like and use lithium power for many things. But sometimes, it is just a waste of time and money. Not to mention, that fire danger.

And unless you've visited a burn ward, where the patients are kept in medical coma's because even morphine can't stop the pain, you may not really appreciate "fire danger" from this stuff. Especially the nameless brands from overseas.

 

[The Chairman]

They tend to be significantly larger than the 18650 size lights,

One would hope so, since one battery is 26mm wide and the other is only 18mm wide. Both are 650mm long. BTW, I. think it's 1/2" pvc pipe that makes a really good spacer when you need the light and don't have a charged 26650 around. They won't last as long as there's not as much juice in the smaller battery.

 

[Doby45]

One would hope so, since one battery is 26mm wide and the other is only 18mm wide. Both are 650mm long. BTW, I. think it's 1/2" pvc pipe that makes a really good spacer when you need the light and don't have a charged 26650 around. They won't last as long as there's not as much juice in the smaller battery.

It is 3/4" PVC that makes a perfect spacer when swapping from a 26650 battery to an 18650 battery.

 

[Doby45]

tbone-
Alkaline batteries will be plenty good enough for someone who is using dive lights just once--for their AOW checkout--and has no plans for regular use beyond that. Which was the OP's situation.
If you want to talk about ridiculous, let's talk about 18650 batteries. I checked with Ultrafire a couple of years ago, and according to them, EVERY vendor selling "Ultrafire" 18650's on ebay and Amazon was selling counterfeits. Not just some of the vendors--but every one of them.
Try to find a vendor that is really selling what they claim to be selling. Even when the "vendor" is a respected domestic company, they may jut be contracting out bids, and not really knowing what they got until they get complaints about it.
Or, even if they KNOW they are buying the best of goods...
Dell, Sony, HP, Apple, Samsung...all have had lithium battery fires and explosions. All respected brand names, and yes, some of those have been 18650's. then there's the extra cost of lithium batteries and rechargers.

Alkaline cells? For someone who isn't planning heavy use of the light, one set can last all year. Much cheaper, simpler, and they never catch fire while you are sleeping. Yes, I like and use lithium power for many things. But sometimes, it is just a waste of time and money. Not to mention, that fire danger.

And unless you've visited a burn ward, where the patients are kept in medical coma's because even morphine can't stop the pain, you may not really appreciate "fire danger" from this stuff. Especially the nameless brands from overseas.

Brand New "4" Panasonic NCR18650B 3400mAh 3.7V 18650 Protected PCB Battery | eBay

Got these, tested them on my OPUS and they all four came out at 3400+ mah. There ARE good quality 18650 batteries out there. I would not use any battery with the word "Fire" in the name.

 

[The Chairman]

It is 3/4" PVC that makes a perfect spacer when swapping from a 26650 battery to an 18650 battery.

Thanks... I've got both in the truck, but I was too lazy to check.

 

[Rred]

One 18650 is roughly 3.7 volts at 3000mAh (if it is among the best, and accurately rated).
One "C" cell battery may only be 1.5 volts, but an alkaline may be rated up to 8000mAh, so the actual available power is higher in the C cell. (12 watt-hours, versus 11.1.)

Not so very different.

 

[tbone1004]

One 18650 is roughly 3.7 volts at 3000mAh (if it is among the best, and accurately rated).
One "C" cell battery may only be 1.5 volts, but an alkaline may be rated up to 8000mAh, so the actual available power is higher in the C cell. (12 watt-hours, versus 11.1.)

Not so very different.

correct, but you need multiple c cells to get the voltage up to a point that is acceptable which increases size and weight. also increases overall cost in the long run since you have to throw c-cells out. I.e. you dive friday for 30 minutes and the light is rated for 60 minutes. You have a 45 minute dive coming up Saturday. You now have to throw away that c-cell instead of just recharging the li-po. Wasteful and gets expensive if you dive regularly. They are also much less convenient for home use. I see literally 0 benefits in diving alkaline dive lights

 

[Trace Malinowski]

Why would you be required to buy primary and secondary lights for AOW?
If you choose to do a night dive as part of your AOW (it's not mandatory...) most instructors provide lights. If you do have to buy some, don't spend much. Get something like THIS for $15 each. You do NOT want a bright light for night diving. Bright lights make nocturnal critters think it's day time. And they go away.
Inexpensive low power lights like this are ideal for night dives or peeking into holes.

The night dive and deep dive components of most AOW courses were the biggest draw for students. They were for me when I was 15 years old. Of course, lights enhance both activities.

I think the difference in the mindset of students was that the education was more important than the C-card. Nobody cared if you had cont. ed. when I started diving. We wanted to know how to dive at night, dive deep and do deco, perform search & recovery, tie cool nautical knots, and navigate course vectors in currents. Rescue was part of OW so after AOW you were essentially done being a student. Now, AOW is just a "bang out" class for many dive shops and instructors. This mindset is unfortunate.

We were required to buy our own lights. You also couldn't rent your basic scuba equipment for AOW. You had to own everything including a tank. Sure, it made the shop a few more bucks, but also made sure we had the tools to go diving and be familiar with it.

Equipment is one of the biggest causes of accidents. Too much of it or unfamiliarity with it has resulted in a myriad of fatalities. I recently had a close call in a cave caused by a switch issue on a borrowed scooter. I teach DPV and Cave DPV, yet I was unfamiliar with an issue this scooter had with a speed selector. While trying to fix the problem to avoid a long swim out we ended up getting sucked into a siphon tunnel and got lost off our guideline. After 35 years, 7500 dives, and 1000 cave dives I was almost undone by a switch.

I've encountered many divers who have had a light failure and had no back-up. By requiring both a primary and back-up light, an instructor can do as much as possible to make sure the student has the proper tools and can become familiar with them.

Also, I hate loaning lights only to have the student flood them and say, "Sorry, man!" Rather than replace them.

 

[Rred]

Tbone, I'd say you've got tunnel vision. Sure, I need two C cells to get (effectively) the same voltage as one lithium cell. So what? You need two lithium batteries to get the same amperage as my one C-cell! You still need TWO of either kind to equal two of either kind. And there are plenty of those damned 3xAAA adapters that replace on 18650 with more volts (4.5) at similar amperage. BFD, you can get the same power in many ways.

Except the alkalines never burst into flames while you're sleeping. And counterfeits are easily avoided.

Do I have to throw away the alkalines? Sure. Then again, I've got my "backup backup" light, which takes 3xAA in one line. Convenient hand sized, bright enough to keep in the BC all the time, and those alkalines? They don't mind going five years without being used or recharged. Plus, I don't have to carry a charger, or make any space in the closet for one. I can stop at any drug store and replace them en route to a dive, don't have to wait four hours to recharge anything.

Hey, the automobile is 100+ years old, and it is first getting as smart as the horse. A horse can find it's own way home when you're too drunk or tired to guide it. Cars? Not quite yet, but there's hope they'll become as smart as horses in another ten or twenty years.(G)

Do I use lithium batteries? Sure. I've got a couple of those nice anonymous Chinese torches. But if I just want to stick one in my pocket, that's a Streamlight that uses two disposable CR123A's. I put 'em in two or three years ago and still haven't had to waste time charging them.(G) And I haven't thrown out the mini Maglite's either. I just put LED's in them.