Air Travel with tanks post TSA

Please register or login

Welcome to ScubaBoard, the world's largest scuba diving community. Registration is not required to read the forums, but we encourage you to join. Joining has its benefits and enables you to participate in the discussions.

Benefits of registering include

  • Ability to post and comment on topics and discussions.
  • A Free photo gallery to share your dive photos with the world.
  • You can make this box go away

Joining is quick and easy. Log in or Register now!

After 39...now 40 posts in this thread, we still do not know for sure what constitutes compressed gas cylinders to the TSA.

I have reviewed all documentation I can find and have yet determined if an unvalved, empty cylinder is prohibited.

Anyone else able to confirm specific determinations?

Thanks,

C_C
 
I swore to myself I would not look at this thread on my days off but I am weak.............as of approx 1630 hrs Thursday February 6th 2003 the "current" SOP stated "no compressed gas cylinders including fire extinguishers" It says nothing about empty, full, assembled, disassembled or whatever. Technically according to the letter of the law NO THE FREAKING THING CAN'T GO! but if you luck out and have a screener look at a tank with the valve removed and be able to shine the light inside it's a good bet it'll go. It's one of the many rules that has Genesis giddy with excitement due to the broad brush strokes.

I'm curious Genesis, were you ever in the military?
:confused:
 
Genesis once bubbled...
Further, if a bomb DID get on a plane and blew it to pieces, the airline would be sunk and the families of the deceased would own all those assets - that is to say, money. The fear of that would insure that NO bombs got on an airplane, because the unlimited liability involved in such an egregious violation of reasonable care would bring steps from the airlines that were actually effective to insure safety.
Perfect security, as you demand, comes at infinite cost.

Your proposal would bring down every mode of tranportation in the US. There's a price on everything -- even lives. You make the tradeoff every day when you buy a car, a motorcycle helmet, whatever.

No, I don't think you'll grasp this simple concept, so I'm outta here -- I know when time spend debating is a complete and utter waste of time.

Roak
 
I'm well aware that perfect security comes at infinite cost - both money AND liberty. I am willing to pay for neither.

However, insulating people (including artificial people - corporations) from the consequences of their bad decisions leads to more bad decisions.

It is one thing to sign a waiver (say, for a dive boat) acknowledging that you might die and that you are personally responsible for that risk.

It is quite another to be sold a bill of goods.

The airlines and government make this claim all the time. They have for years. The "sterile" area, they say. (They very same one in which boxcutters were legitimate permitted items!) The same "sterile" area in which bags are pilfered, invaded, and molested.

Its the hypocrisy - and blatent fraud - that I object to Roakey. Not the fact that perfect security is unobtainable - I am well aware of that, nor do I want it or what it would cost.

However, I object mightily when our government makes knowingly false claims, then allows a private concern to make knowingly false claim and prevents them from suffering the just consequences of people's detrimental reliance on that claim!

This entire airline thing since 9/11 has been a HUGE fraud upon the flying public. It has been an assault upon our time, convenience, the security of our persons and effects - and wallets - both directly and indirectly.

The simple fact of the matter is that our security in air travel, while not perfect, has been pretty damn good in the United States. A particular weak spot - having NOTHING to do with security - was exploited on 9/11. The plan was brilliant, in its own sick, twisted way. It relied upon our belief that a person hijacking a plane wanted transportation and nothing more.

Obviously, we now know that's garbage - that a person committing that act might want to commit murder with the plane itself, not just use the passengers as negotiating tools.

But none of this - absolutely none of it - has a single thing to do with the TSA.

The TSA is a knee-jerk reaction to a non-problem, and it creates more problems than it solves. It has provided the airlines with incentives to be even bigger jerks than they have been over the last 20 years. I have personally watched service levels decline, lie counts increase, and the overall deterioration of the industry over the last 20 years. Until the last two or three years I was a VERY frequent user of their services.

I swore off air travel after 9/11, when the insanity started. The airlines were in trouble before 9/11, you know. The service levels and ticket games had begun - refusing to allow stand-by flying, charging $50 or even $100 to change a departure time even within the same day, voiding tickets if you missed the original plane for any reason (forcing you to buy a full-price, unrestricted coach fare to get where you needed to go), etc.

Not long ago I could walk into an airport with a ticket from Atlanta to Chicago for a flight tomorrow, stroll up to a departure gate with it in hand, and if there were seats available at the last minute get on board and endorse the ticket over. Even if the airline I had the ticket on wasn't the same on I was proposing to fly upon! This was true due to the fact that tickets were fungible, and the airline I flew could endorse that ticket back to the originator and receive face value - or darn close to it - from that company. Tickets were, effectively, money. I did this literally DOZENS of times over the years when my meeting was done early - or later - than planned. I NEVER worried about making the plane, because the next one - assumign it wasn't completely full - was just fine. As long as I had paid, I had a seat - if not now for some reason, like a huge traffic jam in Atlanta, as soon as there was one open on that route.

Now tickets are nothing. In fact, there are no tickets any more, or at least, there won't be soon. Now it is just a registration in a computer. You know why? Its not about cost savings Roak, although that is what the airlines claim. This is all about making tickets NOT fungible, so that you cannot use them in any way EXCEPT on the exact flight you originally booked!

Its a SCAM Roak. So is the carry on baggage nonsense. So is the 50lb weight nonsense. So is the "scuba gear surcharge". So is the TSA. Its ALL just a means to provide you less and less for more and more.

Why were the airlines in trouble? Because people were getting tired of it. Business folks were using videoconferencing - and the internet - instead of getting on planes. Why? Get stranded in Atlanta when you're based in Chicago with the airline lady telling you with a sweet smile that your $600 ticket is worthless because you got caught in traffic or your meeting ran 15 minutes over your planned time, and it'll be $1,100 to get on the next flight - and you will do your damndest not to have THAT happen to you again.

THAT is why the airlines were in trouble Roak. What we've done, post 9-11, is give them a pass on their HORRIBLE business decisions, and the screwing they have laid upon all of us as consumers. We did not bail them out because of terrorism - we bailed them out because they made a bunch of bad business decisions and they went whining to some Senators and Reps and demanded money "or else".

THAT is what happened Roak, and it, and all surrounding it, is one of the classic rip-offs of our collective pocketbooks in the last five years. When you add to that the insults heaped upon by the TSA nonsense, its even more outrageous.
 
The way I look at it is that there is a program in place that you must deal with if you want to fly. If you do not want to comply with that policy....don't fly.
I know of some folks that feel we have no right to tell them they can't just go out and strap a tank to their back and jump in the water.
"Who says I need to get scuba certified?" It is a policy we are willing to endure to enjoy our sport.

As far as Constitutional rights........ Usually when I get on a plane it is to go on vacation and most of the time it is out of the country. It seems to me that 15 minutes after I get on the plane...I HAVE NO CONSTITUTIONAL RIGHTS....I just left them back in the United States. I tried packing them and taking them with me on vacation once but the TSA found them and removed them from my bag.
 
I tried packing them and taking them with me on vacation once but the TSA found them and removed them from my bag.




:rofL: :D :D :D :D
 
I know of some folks that feel we have no right to tell them they can't just go out and strap a tank to their back and jump in the water.
"Who says I need to get scuba certified?" It is a policy we are willing to endure to enjoy our sport.

Ah, but you can just go out and strap a tank to your back.

Nobody stops you. Nobody CAN stop you. There is no law prohibiting it, and no policeman can - or will - stop you.

There is a huge difference between a voluntary, private agreement and force - literally - at gunpoint (as all government enforcement is.)
 
Yup, he didn't get it.

Ever consider Valium, Genesis?

Roak
 
Valium works because it reduces neuronal firing in the brain.
There is a chance that the Valium may be denying Karls brain its constitutional right to experience anxiety........
 

Back
Top Bottom