Advice on slinging an AL40

[doctormike]

Not going solo yet, but going to be buddying up with unfamiliar divers in cold water, so having redundant air seemed like a good idea. I agree with you though; if I was going solo, I'd put the pony second stage on the necklace, leave it on (since I'd notice a freeflow under my chin), and skip the octopus.

Yup, that's one option, but not one that I would prefer for OC. I would just sling your pony and keep the second stage bungeed to the tank, charged and off.

As I mentioned, if you are slinging a pony, you should have no problem puling the bungeed second stage from the tank and turning on the gas. A slung pony like this (as opposed to having the second stage bungeed around your neck) also gives you the option of handing the whole thing off to a diver who needs gas, or if you prefer just donate the pony second stage and keep the tank clipped to you. And it's a more streamlined configuration, since if you are putting the pony reg on a necklace, the hose needs to be precisely the right length or it will either tether you or create a hose loop.

So since you are carrying a 40, why not just dispense with your back gas octopus? Why do you need it, even if you are diving in a team? If someone needs gas, you have it for them in the form of a completely redundant scuba unit that you can donate completely or just donate the reg. Far preferable to the "standard" single tank configuration of donating half of your only gas source with an octopus.

Why dive with three second stages when the extra one is just something else to free flow? In terms of gas loss, a free flow is a way to lose a large volume very quickly.

 

[Cowfish Aesthetic]

Yup, that's one option, but not one that I would prefer for OC. I would just sling your pony and keep the second stage bungeed to the tank, charged and off.

As I mentioned, if you are slinging a pony, you should have no problem puling the bungeed second stage from the tank and turning on the gas. A slung pony like this (as opposed to having the second stage bungeed around your neck) also gives you the option of handing the whole thing off to a diver who needs gas, or if you prefer just donate the pony second stage and keep the tank clipped to you. And it's a more streamlined configuration, since if you are putting the pony reg on a necklace, the hose needs to be precisely the right length or it will either tether you or create a hose loop.

All valid points. I don't actually have any intention of going solo in the near future, so I'm not likely to have to decide, but I'll keep this in mind if I do.

So since you are carrying a 40, why not just dispense with your back gas octopus? Why do you need it, even if you are diving in a team? If someone needs gas, you have it for them in the form of a completely redundant scuba unit that you can donate completely or just donate the reg. Far preferable to the "standard" single tank configuration of donating half of your only gas source with an octopus.

Why dive with three second stages when the extra one is just something else to free flow? In terms of gas loss, a free flow is a way to lose a large volume very quickly.

A few reasons: 1) the pony isn't something I plan to add to my regular setup. I only plan to use it when diving without my regular buddy or in cold water (or in this case, both). Most of my diving is still in the Caribbean with my wife. As a result, I would like to alter as little of my regular setup as possible in the name of consistency. In an emergency, my muscle memory is likely to have me looking for the necklaced reg first, because it's always there, on every dive I do. 2) In the same way, if someone else is OOG, muscle memory says give them the primary in my mouth on the long hose, and go to the necklace. Once I'm on the necklace and everyone is situated, I can go to the pony or donate it. But when seconds count, I want my reactions to be second nature, and the only way I know to accomplish that is consistency and practice. 3) Removing the necklaced second only negates the likelihood of that particular reg freeflowing unnoticed, which I judge to be a low risk because it is under my chin, it is set to predive, and there's no current to speak of in the quarry.

 

[doctormike]

A few reasons: 1) the pony isn't something I plan to add to my regular setup. I only plan to use it when diving without my regular buddy or in cold water (or in this case, both). Most of my diving is still in the Caribbean with my wife. As a result, I would like to alter as little of my regular setup as possible in the name of consistency. In an emergency, my muscle memory is likely to have me looking for the necklaced reg first, because it's always there, on every dive I do. 2) In the same way, if someone else is OOG, muscle memory says give them the primary in my mouth on the long hose, and go to the necklace. Once I'm on the necklace and everyone is situated, I can go to the pony or donate it. But when seconds count, I want my reactions to be second nature, and the only way I know to accomplish that is consistency and practice. 3) Removing the necklaced second only negates the likelihood of that particular reg freeflowing unnoticed, which I judge to be a low risk because it is under my chin, it is set to predive, and there's no current to speak of in the quarry.

Up to you, of course, but don't sell yourself short. If you are comfortable diving in cold water and adding a pony to that regulation, you are probably comfortable enough in the water to be situationally aware, and optimize your diving for your environment. There is no reason why you should feel that you have to dive the exact same rig in a cold quarry and in the Caribbean. Most experienced divers do adapt their rigs to the dive. And any configuration that you adopt should come with some practice as well.

Keep the standard setup for Caribbean diving - octo on a necklace, primary in your mouth, ready to donate. When you are diving somewhere that you feel the need for a pony, that's your backup.

Just a suggestion, not sure if you had thought of it, but obviously there are many ways to deal with this issue!

 

[Cowfish Aesthetic]

Up to you, of course, but don't sell yourself short. If you are comfortable diving in cold water and adding a pony to that regulation, you are probably comfortable enough in the water to be situationally aware, and optimize your diving for your environment. There is no reason why you should feel that you have to dive the exact same rig in a cold quarry and in the Caribbean. Most experienced divers do adapt their rigs to the dive. And any configuration that you adopt should come with some practice as well.

Keep the standard setup for Caribbean diving - octo on a necklace, primary in your mouth, ready to donate. When you are diving somewhere that you feel the need for a pony, that's your backup.

Just a suggestion, not sure if you had thought of it, but obviously there are many ways to deal with this issue!

Definitely, and I genuinely appreciate the advice.

 

[rsingler]

Just to add to the confusion, I leave the pony ON, but second stage off via an inline Omni switch. First stage won't flood, and second stage ready instantly minus 2 seconds.

That fat o-ring is there to protect an unaware buddy if I hand it off. As I slide the online switch on, that oring falls into the gap behind the slider, making it difficult to turn the inline switch back off, since he/she's maybe not familiar with my setup.

 

[JohnN]

Just to add to the confusion, I leave the pony ON, but second stage off via an inline Omni switch. First stage won't flood, and second stage ready instantly minus 2 seconds.
View attachment 453936
That fat o-ring is there to protect an unaware buddy if I hand it off. As I slide the online switch on, that oring falls into the gap behind the slider, making it difficult to turn the inline switch back off, since he/she's maybe not familiar with my setup.
View attachment 453938

Nice touch with the O ring. I'm going to add one today

You didn't mention an OPV Over-Pressure Relief Valve (User Adjustable) as a necessary bit.

 

[doctormike]

Nice touch with the O ring. I'm going to add one today

You didn't mention an OPV Over-Pressure Relief Valve (User Adjustable) as a necessary bit.

Why do you need that on a regulator with a second stage?

 

[The Chairman]

Now when I dive a slung bailout bottle,

I dive a Shrimp (a BOV) as well as an additional BO on CC. CC is an entirely different animal than what we're discussing here.

@Cowfish Aesthetic Dive and let dive: do what seems best FOR YOU. None of us are doing your dive for you so you get to choose. Yay you! Consistency is a great asset. Deco, stage and OMG! bottles are all handled under the same protocol by me. I don't want to put a reg in my mouth and have to consider what I did with this one as compared to another one. As @RyanT pointed out, it only takes a 1/4 turn and you are breathing

A couple of additional thoughts. For me, bail out implies being on a CCR. On OC, it's either redundant gas if it's the same mix or an OMG! bottle if it's air. It's my opinion that solo divers should probably be carrying air in their OMG! bottle. Why? It's always breathable. You won't have to drain the 36 and put in 28 to match your mix on a deep dive. I actually had the same fill on one OMG! bottle for six years and it was an AL19. I breathed it once every dive and never ran out of gas. I never did a vis or hydro as it had never been emptied. I sold it when I moved to AL40s.

Caveat: just because you can carry a bottle, doesn't mean you have the knowledge and/or training to use it safely. It amazes me how quickly people spend money on gear and yet are reticent to pay for training that will enable them to use it safely and get the most out of it.

 

[JohnN]

Why do you need that on a regulator with a second stage?

With the valve closed, the only mechanism for a run-away IP would be to blow a hole in the hose

 

[rsingler]

Nice touch with the O ring. I'm going to add one today

You didn't mention an OPV Over-Pressure Relief Valve (User Adjustable) as a necessary bit.

Yes, OPV for sure! Thanks for reminding us. You can't see it in the photo.