A pre-dive meal at KFC or MickeyD's to reduce risk of DCS?+

[DocVikingo]

Doc, I know all about the placebo effect, but the differences in performance would be impossible for placebo to accomplish...

Hey Dan,

The literature on placebo effects in fact does show that it can result in such "performance" differences.

Anyway, hopefully I have not gotten on the wrong side of these postings with you, as I ALWAY look forward to reading your comments, and see you as a spectacular resource for this community......

That is extremely kind of you to say. And you most certainly have not gotten on my bad side. You consistently have been courteous and gentlemanly; attempted to see the possible merit in opposing arguments; and at base interested in getting at the truth, rather than just defending your own position or spouting unsupported opinions. In my world, this sort of interchange is welcome.

Top 'o the morning to you.

Regards,

DocV

 

[TSandM]

I suspect that, if there is any correlation between state of hydration and efficiency of offgassing, it has far more to do with effective perfusion of tissues than with total body fluid volume. Centralizing the circulation in situations of volume loss will lead to decreased perfusion of precisely the tissues that want to hold onto nitrogen anyway -- especially subcutaneous fat.

 

[calicant]

I buy two Gatorade when I do a long distance backpacking trip because the bottles are light compared to the usual hiker ones made of metal or nalgene. I throw away the Gatorade and fill them with water. I like tabs for electrolyte balance. They are light and easy to store. Water out of a creek above 10,000' in the Sierras tastes so much nicer than the bottled water corporate gangsters sell us for a price higher than gasoline.

 

[markmantei]

The theory today is that my Cardiologist says to take one aspirin every day, even if I don't dive.

I've never heard of asprin before diving, but I wonder if this shouldn't be stressed more, particlularly for divers with "risk factors" for having a cardiac event. I don't know the stats, but wouldn't be surprised if heart attacks kill more divers than DCS anyway, and if daily asprin has a protective effect it should be standard practice (at least for those with risk factors anyway).

 

[danvolker]

I had emailed Terry on this discussion, and here is a response from him:
“The reason there is no “product specific” research posted – as some may realize – this information and research is proprietary to our product and as such is part and parcel of the intellectual property that we strive so hard to protect – and is the meat of our patent filings and we are protecting it as much as we can until which time the USPTO opens the file (at which point all of the information is in the public domain – but at that point is covered by our patent filing) as information of this nature is “secure” once a filing is being prosecuted…that aside – there is substantial “prior art” as far as research and all one has to do is understand the basics of physiology to understand the IMPLICATIONS that these ingredients and hydration as a whole plays in regard to health.
As to the comment that hydration due to H2O Overdrive supports immune function or lessens viral effects (or however he stated it) – I suggest reading the literature and research on the “positive attributes of an anabolic state of being” – and one can soon realize it is that “state” of physiology that I refer to. The positive anabolic state helps protect the body and supports the immune system. It is not that H2O Overdrive is a “miracle”. It is simply that it is an easy way to support an anabolic state via hydration.” [end of Giles quotes/comments]



So I would now be moving on to the issue of hydration for divers once again

For better perfusion ( blood flow) , optimal hydration is smarter for divers, than not drinking during the dive trip, or even drinking sodas.

The sodas will be poor at hydration compared to water, and the sugar will interfere with so many metabolic activities ( insulin spiking/insulin sensitivity issues/decrease of essential hormones/sugar interferes severely with adsorbtion of calcium, which is an essential electrolyte, and crucial for preventing muscle cramping/etc).

Sodas remain the number one choice of charter boats, to offer divers, due mostly to demand by divers and low price of sodas. Apparently, you do get what you pay for sometimes.....
This should change. Water and low or no sugar snacks ( no aspartame products either or drinks like Cytomax, or Overdrive, and their are a few other quality choices I could mention. Gatorade is NOT one of them !!!

 

[DocVikingo]

Water out of a creek above 10,000' in the Sierras tastes so much nicer than the bottled water corporate gangsters sell us for a price higher than gasoline.

Hi calicant,

IMHO, the sale of bottled water/oxygenated water/water with amino acids/etc is among the biggest swindles in recorded history. However, there seems to be almost no end of people willing to participate in it on a regular basis.

About the only meaningful thing I can see on behalf of most bottled waters is convenience and in that regard I'd ask, "Is the convenience is worth the environmental impact"?

Many of the big name waters (e.g., Aquafina, Dasani) are nothing but local public (read "tap") water subjected to additional filtration, and some don't even get that. And just because additional fitration or "purifying" steps have been taken doesn't mean the water is free of microbial pathogens.

Then of course there's the issue of the potentially very nasty chemicals used in the manufacture of plasic water bottles that can contaminate the fluid inside, such as BPA and phthalates.

OTOH, that cool, clear, refreshing mountain steam water is a good way to contract giardiasis.

To each his own.

Regards,

DocVikingo

 

[Thalassamania]

Until I see double blind testing on the performance claims they will remain (as far as I am concerned) voodoo "science." And as far as "protecting" the secret recipes whilst filing for patents ... that's BS, any good lab can tell you what it's made of in a flash. When I hear claims like that, claims that reek of patent horse pucky, I find it hard to take any of the other claims seriously.

 

[DocVikingo]

Amen, Sister Thalassamania. What a crock.

Thanks,

DocV

 

[danvolker]

Until I see double blind testing on the performance claims they will remain (as far as I am concerned) voodoo "science." And as far as "protecting" the secret recipes whilst filing for patents ... that's BS, any good lab can tell you what it's made of in a flash. When I hear claims like that, claims that reek of patent horse pucky, I find it hard to take any of the other claims seriously.

Personally, I like to read through the "whys" of a product, and if it sounds interesting, I am likely to try it.
With overdrive, if you are a person that does well with protein, you should get hydration and performance results far surpassing any other sports drink you have ever tried....If you were not so far away Thal, I would send you a few of my bottles

As far as the research being terribly meaningful for sport supplements.....with enough money, a company can make a great case for Pigs being able to fly, and have research to back it up. Gatorade is one example..... The sweetener "Equal" is a sick and equally strong example of huge money being able to make "pigs fly". Known to be carcinogenic, it was not superior to saccharin, and has been linked to numerous inflamatory conditions. Between the huge money rersearch, and an FDA that does NOT protect the public, but instead helps the big corporations and pharmeceutical giants to maintain dominance in the world, regardless of health issues, we are now getting in to the difference between good science, and prostituted science.
In the world of sports nutrition, the prostituted variety is the norm, as it is in the pharmeceutical world ( with products like statins).
I prefer to try things myself....At 56, I am still faster on the bike than most 30 year olds by a wide margin, so I must be doing something right Better nutrition and better hydration is a huge competitive advantage, one the 21 to 35 year olds rarely pay any attention to

 

[DocVikingo]

I've never heard of aspirin before diving, but I wonder if this shouldn't be stressed more, particularly for divers with "risk factors" for having a cardiac event. I don't know the stats, but wouldn't be surprised if heart attacks kill more divers than DCS anyway, and if daily aspirin has a protective effect it should be standard practice (at least for those with risk factors anyway).

Hi Mark,

Make no mistake, cardiac/cardiovascular abnormality and disease kill vastly more divers than DCI, both u/w and topside.

And, in those for whom it is not contraindicated, there is much to recommend the cardiovascular prophylactic effects of a small daily dose of ASA. Most of the physicians whom I know take such a dose.

However, the focus of discussion in this thread concerns taking aspirin solely for the purpose of reducing the risk DCS. As post #20 above indicates, there is no basis for believing ASA is effective in doing so.

Regards,

DocVikingo