cornfed
Mindless lemming
No one expected the towers to fall.
A divers arrogance and ignorance
- Thread starter mars2u
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No one expected the towers to fall.
cornfed
Mindless lemming
Mike, is this team made up of volunteers or career personel?
Cornfed
Adding to what zagnut said .... firefighters are not uniformed about the buildings they fight fires in. They know there is nothing that is 100% fireproof. Most of their leaders are highly trained to understand building mechanics and structures .... especially in big cities that have lots of high rise buildings.
Fireproofing for steel is by design intended give occupants time to get out of the building before the heat causes the steel to go more elastic and fail. Firefighters know this.
How do i know they know this? I trained volunteer firefighters for almost ten years in basic structural engineering mechanics. They might not have known, absolutely, that the towers were coming down, but they knew they would if the fire was bad enough. How bad did the fires look to you?
Dryglove
Contributor
You might but i wouldnt. He risked his life trying to save another. Its all a matter of opinion. I would not expect him to do what he did as it was stupid but courageous. Like i said before he is lucky to be alive.
I dont recall anybody calling the two special forces soldiers that roped in on the blackhawk crash in somalia dumbasses even though they basically knew they wouldnt come out alive.
Most of the teams around here are made up of police and fireman. Everything but divers. In some cases they get OW certified and are on the team.
In the county where my shop is as of 1 1/2 years ago there were 12 guys on the team. 7 of them were only OW certified. Few teams are lucky enough to get real PSD training like that offered by Dive Rescue international or Lifegard systems. If they're lucky they get a PADI rescue class, PADI S&R and maybe an ice class. Most are novices at best. The real lucky ones get to do the PADI specialties "Law 1 & 2"
The DNR team has a good reputation though I don't know much about them first hand. Also the Indy PD I believe has been incedent free while the Iny FD has lost two divers in training in the last 3 years. Both under the supervision of the same instructor. The instructor was a state police officer who had a contract with the Indy FD worth 9k per year. That contract has been canceled since the law suit has have been filed (the OSHA report is a real treat to read) but as I understand it he has others. Lots of money changing hands and lots of politics but not much equipment or training. BTW, the shop who provides equipment and training to our county team is in another county and owned by a police officer. Our city FD is starting a team and they'll be using the same shop against the wishes of some of the divers and as far as I can tell based totally on the recommendation of the county police department team.
It all stays in the family.
And I thought the recreational diving industry was messed up.
dad6b
Guest
If this is true I was unaware. I was under the impression that they called for all FFs to evacuate the north tower after the first collapsed.
Cornfed
Dryglove
Contributor
Politics is the name of the game and the game sucks. Unfortunately politics rule the game in almost all departments wether it be fire or police. It gets so bad at times it still amazes me. I can only imagine what its like on the fire dept side with dive teams and such.
Take a look at the CA state budget right now. Politics gone bad...lol. Im just waiting to get my notice that ill be getting minimum wage till the budget is settled.I bet the people trying to settle the budget dont reduce their income to minimum wage. I know this was off topic but i hate politics of all shape and sizes when it doesnt benefit nobody.
cornfed
Mindless lemming
Just curious.
I knew some people on the dive team near where I went to college. It was a volunteer rescue squad and the dive team consisted of members that where also divers. I don't know what kind of training they got, but they had stab jackets and j-valves. This was in 2001!
I thought the guy in your rescue story might be volunteer. I know some very squirrely volunteers.
Cornfed
Well Mike, not all teams are this way.
First, do you pay taxes in this county? I would be opening a case of wup-arse on my county representative for letting my tax dollars get out of my county when there was options to spend the money with a county tax payer. Sounds like you should be a concerned tax payer regardless if your store get the business or is still there or not.
The teams in our area are generally all cops or fireman primarily due to liability reasons. If your not on the county payroll, you ain't on the team. They dive monthly, including ice training every year. Are they certified cave divers? No, all we have up here is a lot of open water, no caves.
Happy 4th to all. Later
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