2nd stage issues after yoke to DIN conversion on 50D

[soamelt]

I just had my LDS convert my 50D (not DSV as I called I in my other thread) and everything seem to go well except for the fact my hoses were out if place and the swivel can't do a full rotation with the DIN connector. I was able to use it on a dive and didn't notice any problems. Last night while cleaning my gear, (I rinse everything and then drop my second stages in a bucket if water while my reg is still hooked up to my tank) Last my primary started bubbling and I could hear it hissing when I took it out if the water. The air flow was set to high (which it always is and never does this), so I turned it back and it stopped, but then my octo started doing the same thing (primary and octo ate both Zeagle ZX). I had the air flow on high also, which I turned back, but it did not stop.

I did not notice it on my dive, but it's possible it couldn't have been doing it on it as well.

I seem to be having a lot of problems with his reg. Hopefully this is an easy fix and I'll be able to use it the last week of lobster season. Its only 18 months old (ZX octo only 6), I had my annual service at 12, had a free flow problem shortly before and after the service when my tank pressure was over a certain PSI which I started this thread for. I sent my reg into Zeagle 6 months ago to fix that problem.

 

[gibby_z]

You have something else going on there.
Swapping the yoke to DIN does not change any of the internal pressure settings on the regulator. (Or certainly should not have unless it was done wrong) At a short glance it sounds like you have IP creep. If you are now using DIN tanks the service pressure may be high enough to trigger the creep.

Take it back to the shop and have them watch the IP on a full HP tank.
It should read between 130 and 145 psi.
If the IP rises the 1st stage needs to be corrected. Not just serviced.
If its too high and steady, have the 1st stage adjusted back to spec.
If the 1st stage is in spec and the IP is steady have the 2nd stages looked.
All of this should be done by a qualified Zeagle tech.
Not a reg tech that has tools to fit a Zeagle.

 

[soamelt]

You have something else going on there.
Swapping the yoke to DIN does not change any of the internal pressure settings on the regulator. (Or certainly should not have unless it was done wrong) At a short glance it sounds like you have IP creep. If you are now using DIN tanks the service pressure may be high enough to trigger the creep.

Take it back to the shop and have them watch the IP on a full HP tank.
It should read between 130 and 145 psi.
If the IP rises the 1st stage needs to be corrected. Not just serviced.
If its too high and steady, have the 1st stage adjusted back to spec.
If the 1st stage is in spec and the IP is steady have the 2nd stages looked.
All of this should be done by a qualified Zeagle tech.
Not a reg tech that has tools to fit a Zeagle.

I'm using the same tank I always have been (3442 PSI) since it was yoke (I first noticed the problem while cleaning my gear with less than 500 PSI), I've sent to Zeagle and they put in a different HP seat (which was a professional, I think that what they called it, it's made from a different material than the stock one), set both 2nds to spec. I've only had around 35 dives on it since it went back to Zeagle, I'm less than satisified with the reliability of this reg. However I have been more than satisfied with help I have received from Scott and Jim Fox.

Now I am going to take it in for the third service in 7 months.

 

[redacted]

At this point, you would need an IP gauge to determine if it is simply a matter of needing a minor adjustment or whether there is an IP creep problem that will require a bit more work. Without an IP gauge, the shop is your best recourse.

 

[ScottZeagle]

Jim Fox is heading to NJ for the Beneath the Sea trade show, but drop him an email early next week and I'm sure he can offer you some advice or take a look at it again!!!

Scott

 

[soamelt]

Jim Fox is heading to NJ for the Beneath the Sea trade show, but drop him an email early next week and I'm sure he can offer you some advice or take a look at it again!!!

Scott

Thanks Scott! I don't even feel comfortable taking it into a shop down here unless there's one you recommend. I called two today, the one that couldn't fix my problem last time. They said have the person who swapped my yoke/din needs change the IP and if that's not the problem it's just sand in both of my 2nd stages. Just clean them out real well.

The other shop was saying they will need to rebuild it and it costs extra for the nitrox kit. To which I replied only if I need over 40%? The said for anything 21%-40% (I'm sure they meant over 21%, I hope). They said the regular kit wasn't nitox compatible.

Needless to say, I didn't get the warm and fuzzy feeling from either shop and do need someone in south Florida that is used to working with Zeagle regs.

 

[Bubbletrubble]

@soamelt: It's time to learn more about regulators. Vince Harlow's Airspeed Press book entitled "Scuba Regulator Maintenance and Repair" would be an excellent place to start.

awap's suggestion to get an IP gauge is a very good one. I think anyone who owns a regulator setup should have an IP gauge handy. Essentially, it helps distinguish whether the freeflow issue lies in the first stage or the second stage. It doesn't have to be a very expensive one to verify whether your first stage is putting out an IP that's within the manufacturer's specs. Here's one for less than $16.

I realize that you think you've got a reg "lemon," but it's not unusual to have some freeflow issues shortly after an overhaul as the new seats "take a set." Freeflows prior to an overhaul simply indicate that the reg needs to be serviced or cleaned. I don't know what to make of a freeflow which started shortly after a DIN conversion of the first stage. I guess it's possible that the reg tech accidentally turned the spring adjuster while doing the conversion. Highly unlikely IMO based on the location of that part, though. As previously mentioned by others, you need to check the IP of the first stage and then proceed from there.

 

[soamelt]

I haven't been able to get an IP gauge yet, but tried to recreate the problem last night and couldn't (only have less than 200psi left in my tank though). I noticed the saddle between the 1st stage and the DIN connector had some space between it. Since I had to either take the connector off or rearrange my hoses, I decided to do both. I was able to screw the connector in a hair more, but didn't want to force anything since I beleive It was Awap that said there are torque requirements.

Is it ok/normal that there is a slight gap where the saddle is to the point where I can jiggle it ever so slightly? The saddle did not move at all (I'm pretty sure) with he yoke.

 

[Bubbletrubble]

I haven't been able to get an IP gauge yet, but tried to recreate the problem last night and couldn't (only have less than 200psi left in my tank though). I noticed the saddle between the 1st stage and the DIN connector had some space between it. Since I had to either take the connector off or rearrange my hoses, I decided to do both. I was able to screw the connector in a hair more, but didn't want to force anything since I beleive It was Awap that said there are torque requirements.

Is it ok/normal that there is a slight gap where the saddle is to the point where I can jiggle it ever so slightly? The saddle did not move at all (I'm pretty sure) with he yoke.

What part are you calling the "saddle"? You may have to take a picture and post it for us to take a look. It's not common to have any loose parts on the first stage, although the DIN handwheel can have a little play since it is held on by the DIN connector and screwed into the tank valve.

Yes, as awap pointed out, the DIN connector should be tightened into the first stage according to certain torque specs. Be careful. You don't want to over-tighten anything.

 

[soamelt]

I'll get a picture whe. I get home, but what I'm calling the saddle is a black piece of plastic that sits over the hole where the DIN or yoke connect. It's directly between the 1st stage and hand wheel or between he first stage and yoke connector.