1975 Bauer Capitano & Customer support inquiry dissatisfaction

[RaginCajun]

So I reach out to Bauer to find an operating manual for a new to me vintage 1975 Capitano compressor which is working fine by the way. I also ask about a newer filter tower.

Here's the response. Completely useless.

The compressor works fine. I wanted to know more about it, a unit specific operating manual and what spec oil it should use. Now I wish I had never heard of the Bauer brand. I totally realize that they don't want to touch this with a 10 ft pole but this is ridiculous. I've never heard of customer service so bad.

 

[HKGuns]

Stop Ragin there Cajun.

Have you considered there may not be any documentation OR anyone around that knows much about something that old for which production was likely very low?

They did give you valuable information, don’t introduce NITROX.

I won’t assume you found this or that it is correct. May be of some use.

http://www.beta.jfdefence.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/09/Capitano-Manual-1994.pdf

 

[tbone1004]

you can't really be mad at a company for not supporting a nearly 50 year old piece of equipment that is long since obsolete can you? If you have a car that old do you really expect to be able to call up the manufacturer and get support like that from them? It doesn't happen.... Sorry you're upset, but I think it's unreasonable to expect a global manufacturer of equipment to support obsolete equipment and they may not have digitized any of the old information for it because it may well have been considered obsolete before that was a "thing" to do.

Please do remember about the customer service that this is a VERY large global company that is one of the largest suppliers of HP pumps if not the largest. They are likely bound by corporate rules about giving information that isn't "kosher" because of the liability associated with it. Nitrox wasn't a thing in the 70's, so that model would never have had anything that told how to mix nitrox.
On the oil front, they would only be able to tell you the most recent spec of oil that it had which may be obsolete and unavailable, same with filter towers. That is all part of avoiding any liability if something goes wrong.

Now, the Capitano is still a model, but no different than say a Jeep Wrangler from 1975 vs one from now, there are going to be differences. If we look at this pump like you would with a classic car, you have to make a lot of educated decisions. Mobil 1 was not released until the mid 70's, and while it was released, it was really only in high performance vehicles, likely because of the cost vs. conventional oil. Can you take a car from the 60's and put full synth in it and cause no harm to the engine? Absolutely, it's highly recommended with the caveat that it may expose a lot of bad gaskets. Has nothing to do with the oil being synthetic like many people are led to believe, just that you had leaks that were plugged with gunk and the oil did its job of removing the gunk and now it leaks. Switching to the oil recommended in the new Capitano isn't going to do anything bad, but it may show some seal leakage that you'll have to address. You can switch to whatever the new synthetic oil is recommended by Bauer and you'll be fine.

On the nitrox front, you can search around to figure out what people are doing, but if you had a new Bauer pump, they would only tell you that they are only to be used for air and if you wanted nitrox you had to buy a specific nitrox compressor. We all know that that is only a liability thing because we've been blending nitrox in Bauer compressors longer than they've been making them and there really isn't anything to do in the pump other than using synthetic oil which you should be using anyway. This would be like asking Jeep what you need to do if you wanted to put an electric winch on the front of your vintage Jeep. Could also compare to tires where the manufacturer will only tell you to put the same tires on there that they put on when they built it, not a different model in the same size, only the original tire.

The filters I'm actually kind of surprised they didn't tell you much of anything, though at the same time I don't know what you asked them. Filters are filters and like tires, the manufacturer can only tell you what they had from the factory at that time. There is a lot of support on here with filtration and some true experts can help depending on what you're trying to do with the pump, but unfortunately the OEM isn't going to help you at all.

 

[rhwestfall]

redacted

 

[RaginCajun]

Can a company produce or point to a manual from a product a few decades ago. Dunno. VW can. So yeah, I expected more on this front.

TheSamba.com :: 1974 Beetle Owner's Manual

I suppose his tone of I don't want to do my job or be helpful was the issue. He could have said, hey synthetic oil would be more appropriate and didn't exist back then so that's a dead end. He could also say they can't certify or publicly state that continuous blending is an OEM endorsed use of this equipment. He didn't.

Further, he completely ignored my question about the separate filter skid. Not impressed.

A bunch of unpaid amateurs here have provided more helpful info that the OEM, so yes I'm disappointed that the OEM was unwilling to do more.

Rant over. Respect for this company over, moving on.

 

[Wookie]

Can a company produce or point to a manual from a product a few decades ago. Dunno. VW can. So yeah, I expected more on this front.

TheSamba.com :: 1974 Beetle Owner's Manual

I suppose his tone of I don't want to do my job or be helpful was the issue. He could have said, hey synthetic oil would be more appropriate and didn't exist back then so that's a dead end. He could also say they can't certify or publicly state that continuous blending is an OEM endorsed use of this equipment. He didn't.

Further, he completely ignored my question about the separate filter skid. Not impressed.

A bunch of unpaid amateurs here have provided more helpful info that the OEM, so yes I'm disappointed that the OEM was unwilling to do more.

Rant over. Respect for this company over, moving on.

Your beetle owner's manual isn't provided by Volkswagon, it was provided by TheSamba.com. If you called Volkswagon for a manual (or parts), they would surely laugh. But if you called an aftermarket supplier for those manuals or parts you would surely find one.

If you came here, not to rant about Bauer, but to ask if anyone could help you, I'm sure you would find references to Porter, who would tell you all about your compressor, as he makes his living keeping those old Bauers running for folks just like you. He'd tell you (and sell you) the correct oil, he would have parts from Lawrence Factor as well as bauer stuff he's taken off of other old machines, you'd find a hundred other folks with the same Capitano that would tell you stories for better or worse about pumping nitrox through the compressor.

But for Bauer, making nitrox in the mid-seventies was dividing by zero. In the first place, NOAA hadn't brought Nitrox mainstream, and second, no one will ever tell you that pumping nitrox is safe. Even the folks who make compressors specifically for pumping nitrox have a ton of tricks to keep them working safely. Ask Ray Contera when he pops his head in. He sells compressors specifically for nitrox, and is one of the very few to do so.

I'm running 1978 M.A.N. engines in my dive boat. I bought the last 2 heat exchangers in the world. Old junk just isn't supported by the manufacturer. But they are happy to sell you a new version of the Capitano....

 

[RaginCajun]

Ok ok, let me try to swallow this big ole cocktail of chill pill & humility. Truth & fear that I may have spent a few thousand on something that won't quite do what I thought is also tough to swallow but it's a problem that I just have to figure out how to solve without the OEM as I expected.

Thanks for sensible words everyone. Now back to solving problems like trying to make this thing pump safe air and maybe modify it safely to continuous blend.

 

[tbone1004]

@RaginCajun that we can help you with!

@Wookie mentioned Porter, Porter is Porter Stiles and founded August Industries
Welcome to August Industries - August Industries Inc.

Most recent manuals will be here
Block Manual - August Industries Inc.

I'd contact them and ask about lubricants and any other concerns that you have with the block specifically.

@rcontrera was mentioned as well
Coltri Sub High Pressure Breathing Air Compressors from RCS

 

[Wookie]

Ok ok, let me try to swallow this big ole cocktail of chill pill & humility. Truth & fear that I may have spent a few thousand on something that won't quite do what I thought is also tough to swallow but it's a problem that I just have to figure out how to solve without the OEM as I expected.

Thanks for sensible words everyone. Now back to solving problems like trying to make this thing pump safe air and maybe modify it safely to continuous blend.

That pump is as safe as can be.

I'm personally not a big fan of that particular filter system. I would buy a filter can to hold whatever filter is your favorite and a separate moisture separator.

You will want Chemlube 800 oil in the pump. If it has more than 1000 hours on it, maybe chemlube 751. You can get by with chemlube 500 (it's what I use regardless of age), YMMV. Porter will know exactly what you need for that particular machine.

 

[tbone1004]

@RaginCajun to echo what I said earlier and what @Wookie said above, the filters really don't matter as far a being "Bauer compatible" or whatever. They come after the pumping is done and as long as they have a PMV on there to make the final stage happy, the pump really doesn't care.
The Capitano is a 5cfm pump which is quite small so the filters don't need to be that big, and oversizing them will just increase your change interval vs. making the air "better".

I am A HUGE fan of separate moisture separators and coalescers and believe in having them outside of the normal filter stack. Knocking out as much water as possible makes your filters last longer by knocking most of the bad stuff out with the water and preventing your coalescer from having to work so hard. Lots of filtration discussions on here that you can search through, just don't include "bauer" in there because it will probably reduce your results too much.

I am rebuilding a pair of Rix SA6 compressors which are about the same size as yours. One to keep at my place, one to leave at @The Chairman 's house for continuous blending nitrox. They will have excessive filtration put on there in terms of trying to get the water and particulates out, then "normal" filtration for getting rid of the CO and CO2. This will allow the filters to go to their full life since cave country and SC aren't exactly the driest of locales....