Why can't you make a living as an Instructor?

[boulderjohn]

Once the agency issues a certification, they've made their money, and it really doesn't matter to them if you ever dive again. Making it all about the profit of the the entry gatekeeper will kill anything.

The latest in a series of ridiculous statements.

• The dive agency makes money with your continuing education. In the case of PADI, they also have a major dive travel organization. They want you to continue diving, and they want you to do that diving with them doing the planning for you.
• The dive shop/instructor where you train, the people who actually did the instruction, have a major interest in your continuing to dive. In fact, in many cases they lose money through instruction, a loss they hope to make up for with your gear purchases and travel. The dive shop with which I am associated now makes by far most of its money through dve travel, taking the divers they certify to dive locations around the world.

 

[Centrals]

Once the agency issues a certification, they've made their money, and it really doesn't matter to them if you ever dive again. Making it all about the profit of the the entry gatekeeper will kill anything.

Absolutely rubbish.
"Continuous education" will bring in a lot more money!!!!
PADI:
OW, AOW, Rescue, 5 specialities to qualify for MSD.
DM, OW instructor, Speciality instructor, master Scuba diver trainer and finally CD.
As for technical diving........

BTW, how many certificate do you have? ONE?

 

[bfw]

Absolutely rubbish.
"Continuous education" will bring in a lot more money!!!!
PADI:
OW, AOW, Rescue, 5 specialities to qualify for MSD.
DM, OW instructor, Speciality instructor, master Scuba diver trainer and finally CD.
As for technical diving........

BTW, how many certificate do you have? ONE?

And what percentage of PADI OW certs go on to further certs? 2% if they're lucky. Pyramid schemes make all their money off fresh meat in the bottom tier.

The number of certifications I have means nothing - I'm not normal.

 

[bfw]

The latest in a series of ridiculous statements.

• The dive agency makes money with your continuing education. In the case of PADI, they also have a major dive travel organization. They want you to continue diving, and they want you to do that diving with them doing the planning for you.
• The dive shop/instructor where you train, the people who actually did the instruction, have a major interest in your continuing to dive. In fact, in many cases they lose money through instruction, a loss they hope to make up for with your gear purchases and travel. The dive shop with which I am associated now makes by far most of its money through dve travel, taking the divers they certify to dive locations around the world.

Just what percentage of PADI's revenue do you think comes from something other than OW students and member dues? I'd be surprised if it's more than 3% - pyramid schemes make their money off incoming bottom tier customers.

You repeat the prior respondent's mistake of conflating the dive shop with the agency. I've seen several dive shops that were dyed in the wool PADI fanatics switch to SSI because SSI's business model aligns better with the interests of the dive shop.

 

[Esprise Me]

And what percentage of PADI OW certs go on to further certs? 2% if they're lucky. Pyramid schemes make all their money off fresh meat in the bottom tier.

The number of certifications I have means nothing - I'm not normal.

There was a thread on this a few years ago; PADI apparently once published an estimate of 15-20% of OW divers going on to AOW. It's surprisingly difficult to find this info anywhere, but 15-20% strikes me as plausible. Percentage of divers who go beyond openwater?

Even if it's only 2% or less, though, I don't see how that would make it a pyramid scheme. *If* recreational divers are being pressured into going pro with false promises that they'll recoup their investment and more, and pros are being pressured to get their OW students to go pro so that the pros can make up their losses, that would come closer to the definition of a pyramid scheme. But a bunch of people just getting their OW and no more could just be a bunch of satisfied customers.

 

[bfw]

Even if it's only 2% or less, though, I don't see how that would make it a pyramid scheme.

Pyramid schemes are misnamed. They should be called parabolic cone schemes. The top tier are basically the one percenters.

And that 15-20% figure seems suspectfully optimistic to me. At the shops with which I'm familiar, about 2% went on to AOW. At PADI updates they were constantly saying the number of people who never went beyond OW was a huge problem. Most of PADI's revenue comes from people who get OW, go on one trip, and then it's off to get the next hole punched in their "been there, done that" ticket.

 

[Centrals]

And what percentage of PADI OW certs go on to further certs? 2% if they're lucky. Pyramid schemes make all their money off fresh meat in the bottom tier.

The number of certifications I have means nothing - I'm not normal.

Any link to substantiate it? You just picked a random number?
All my recreational dive buddies have more than a few certification card with no exception. It is 100%. Period.

So how many card do you have? One or more than one.
Hypocrite if you have more than one. Period.

It seems to me that there is another member who only believes in himself/herself!!!

 

[Centrals]

Pyramid schemes are misnamed. They should be called parabolic cone schemes. The top tier are basically the one percenters.

And that 15-20% figure seems suspectfully optimistic to me. At the shops with which I'm familiar, about 2% went on to AOW. At PADI updates they were constantly saying the number of people who never went beyond OW was a huge problem. Most of PADI's revenue comes from people who get OW, go on one trip, and then it's off to get the next hole punched in their "been there, done that" ticket.

Your own limited experiences does not apply to others!
Do you have any link to proof that 15-20% is suspectable?

 

[bfw]

Your own limited experiences does not apply to others!
Do you have any link to proof that 15-20% is suspectable?

No, that's why I said suspect, rather than false. Through 20 years of PADI updates, they constantly hammered on getting more people to take con ed courses, a lot harder than one would expect if 1 out of 5 OW certs was going on to AOW.

My own OW class had 20+ students, and I was the only one to go on to AOW.

 

[bfw]

Any link to substantiate it? You just picked a random number?

I base that on my observation from 20 years as a PADI member, and comparing the number of OW students versus AOW and above, not only at our shop, but at other shops in our town and other shops using quarries in our region.

Further, since you're so fixated on links, according to this:

https://www.padi.com/sites/default/files/documents/2021-02/2021%20PADI%20Worldwide%20Statistics.pdf

only 0.5% of those PADI certifies make it to Divemaster, so if anything, when I referred to the top tier of the pyramid as one percenters, I was understating it, since Divemasters aren't the top tier.

All my recreational dive buddies have more than a few certification card with no exception. It is 100%. Period.

Same with all my buddies, but in your next reply you say something about not over-extrapolating one's personal experience. You're a Scubaboard member - 90% of the divers I've met have never heard of Scubaboard. I don't assume that I'm statistically representative; neither should you.

So how many card do you have? One or more than one.
Hypocrite if you have more than one. Period.

Hypocrite how? I never said anything about the value or advisability of taking con ed courses - I said most people don't do it. You might want to check your logic skills before throwing out accusations involving concepts like hypocrisy.

It seems to me that there is another member who only believes in himself/herself!!!

And here you completely stop making sense.